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A glimmer and signs of club rugby coming back

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PiffPaff View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PiffPaff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct 2020 at 15:55
So this mentions "no meaningful season", which got me to ask some questions of my contact down at Twickenham today, and its in the course of apparently being ratified i.e No League competition, therefore no promotion/relegation but the possibility of small localised Groups playing toward a one off "Cup Final".......... if we are lucky!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scrumtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct 2020 at 16:27
Makes sense!

Be interesting to see what affect it has on clubs at levels 2,3 and 4
On the financial front! 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote marigold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct 2020 at 16:53
Think clubs at level 2-the Championship- counted as elite rugby so not in this grouping -so will be from National One down. Certainly less travel costs, more local derbies so if allowed bigger crowds. If no promotion/relegation will players be paid?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct 2020 at 17:08
I assume this is the plan for eight groups of six with 10 matches in the first phase.
Then pools of 4 for cup, plate and shield,  semi finals and finals

There were issues with Guensey being put in East Anglia in the initial draft - which would be fine if there were flights to Stansted, Cambridge or Southend. But less than optimal if the flights are only going to Southampton and Gatwick. Who know Autigny might be prepared to arrange those given nobody else is flying - or it could be avian porcines.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scrumtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct 2020 at 17:18
I was under the impression that what was posted was made up and had nothing to do with NCA according to Mr Inverdale’s post, just guesswork by someone with too much time on their hands!  

I would suspect a new round of crowd funding by clubs and level 3 and 4 then. Some of which had already advance sold season tickets for this season.

Be interesting how that’s received as post last time clubs and D of R’s then announced a raft of signings and players!! 




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct 2020 at 21:45
Originally posted by Scrumtime Scrumtime wrote:

I was under the impression that what was posted was made up and had nothing to do with NCA according to Mr Inverdale’s post, just guesswork by someone with too much time on their hands!  

I would suspect a new round of crowd funding by clubs and level 3 and 4 then. Some of which had already advance sold season tickets for this season.

Be interesting how that’s received as post last time clubs and D of R’s then announced a raft of signings and players!! 






Signings were understandable last time around as most people expected the league season to start in November.

Not sure raising money to pay players will go down that well now there isn't going to be a league season.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Halliford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct 2020 at 22:24
The basic concept of a 15 match NCA Cup with teams in groups of 6 leading to a Final is probable and was one of the suggestions in the August consultation. Giles Hilton of Canterbury was very vocal in insisting on local matches - the suggested group put them in West London!! The groups were fictitious. There is, I hear, a meeting tomorrow with the Government which may offer more clarity.
Talking to our players they just want to play and are prepared to take the consequences. We have 3 friendlies planned for December, under whatever rules we are allowed then. I think they all understand that there will be no payment for an NCA Cup and we are already looking forward to next season when, hopefully, we will have something closer to normality.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct 2020 at 23:14
Originally posted by Halliford Halliford wrote:

The basic concept of a 15 match NCA Cup with teams in groups of 6 leading to a Final is probable and was one of the suggestions in the August consultation. Giles Hilton of Canterbury was very vocal in insisting on local matches - the suggested group put them in West London!! The groups were fictitious. There is, I hear, a meeting tomorrow with the Government which may offer more clarity.
Talking to our players they just want to play and are prepared to take the consequences. We have 3 friendlies planned for December, under whatever rules we are allowed then. I think they all understand that there will be no payment for an NCA Cup and we are already looking forward to next season when, hopefully, we will have something closer to normality.

They are prepared to risk their own suffering, or even death or perhaps the death of their family members to play rugby?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scrumtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 07:47
Originally posted by Halliford Halliford wrote:

The basic concept of a 15 match NCA Cup with teams in groups of 6 leading to a Final is probable and was one of the suggestions in the August consultation. Giles Hilton of Canterbury was very vocal in insisting on local matches - the suggested group put them in West London!! The groups were fictitious. There is, I hear, a meeting tomorrow with the Government which may offer more clarity.
Talking to our players they just want to play and are prepared to take the consequences. We have 3 friendlies planned for December, under whatever rules we are allowed then. I think they all understand that there will be no payment for an NCA Cup and we are already looking forward to next season when, hopefully, we will have something closer to normality.

I think there is no chance of UK Gov letting you or anybody else play in Dec. It may be a very different story at Esher but I would suggest that players in very troubled areas will not be doing this. Can you see UK Gov letting people in Caldy, Sale and DMP or any of the sides in Nat 2 North play rugby, I think not!

Saying that I see DMP started a Crowd Funder yesterday the first of many I would think!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 09:11
Originally posted by Scrumtime Scrumtime wrote:

Originally posted by Halliford Halliford wrote:

The basic concept of a 15 match NCA Cup with teams in groups of 6 leading to a Final is probable and was one of the suggestions in the August consultation. Giles Hilton of Canterbury was very vocal in insisting on local matches - the suggested group put them in West London!! The groups were fictitious. There is, I hear, a meeting tomorrow with the Government which may offer more clarity.
Talking to our players they just want to play and are prepared to take the consequences. We have 3 friendlies planned for December, under whatever rules we are allowed then. I think they all understand that there will be no payment for an NCA Cup and we are already looking forward to next season when, hopefully, we will have something closer to normality.

I think there is no chance of UK Gov letting you or anybody else play in Dec. It may be a very different story at Esher but I would suggest that players in very troubled areas will not be doing this. Can you see UK Gov letting people in Caldy, Sale and DMP or any of the sides in Nat 2 North play rugby, I think not!

Saying that I see DMP started a Crowd Funder yesterday the first of many I would think!

Why would they let anyone play?  Look at the amount of positive tests that rugby is generating due to the training and contact. You can imagine those Wasps lads have done everything possible to avoid close contact yet still 11 test positive. This isn’t something pleasant, it isn’t something that only affects the old, this isn’t something we know a lot about and it appears long term has greater complications.
For the sake of a game on National one rugby?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote greeneyed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 10:59
DMP's crowdfunding effort https://www.mowdenpark.com/news/mowden-launch-yourclub-crowdfunder-campaign-2579219.html pleads the 'community club' status to great effect. Forgive me if I'm wrong, but hasn't DMP just been taken over and is no longer a member's club?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PiffPaff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 10:59
OMG I'm agreeing with MB again!
 
Nigel, you come across as a Glass Half Full kind of guy and appreciate that but if you think parts of the country are going to be ok to play before other area's then u are out of touch. Stage E was up to a few weeks ago almost within coughing distance. Sadly since then country (UK never mind England) has gone to set new records on the infection front. We won't hit E until after the New Year if we are lucky. Personally I think we'll be raising the White Flag in February and cancelling 20/21 season full stop.
 
The RFU are now beginning to panic, the end of 19/20 6Ns, Autumn Int and new 6Ns should bring in much needed TV cash to fill in some of the financial holes the RFU are in. No Baa-Baa's could be the 1st of many cancellations and the RFU will have to re-adjust even more.
 
Also are you 100% sure your players at Esher will play potential Covid spreading friendlies for nothing.  Players in the National Leagues use match fees now as a source of upping their income to help fund their lifestyle and pay bills. Quite sure you have players who live some distance from Esher in your squad, would you travel say 80-100 miles round trip for a pint,  a pie and illness that could kill a family member?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Albert Fishwick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 12:19
I believe Esher is at level 2 on the Covid restrictions so I can't see any favourable treatment being allowed.
That's easy for you to say.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Runitback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 12:31
I cannot see the season going ahead now, a vaccine was the only hope and that will be available by late Spring at earliest, and I am not sure rugby players will be a priority!!!

Mr Robshaw has just damaged his legacy, and I thought rugby players were consider intellectually superior to footballers!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Neasham Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 13:36
Originally posted by greeneyed greeneyed wrote:

DMP's crowdfunding effort https://www.mowdenpark.com/news/mowden-launch-yourclub-crowdfunder-campaign-2579219.html pleads the 'community club' status to great effect. Forgive me if I'm wrong, but hasn't DMP just been taken over and is no longer a member's club?

That’s correct. Owned by a businessman from Sheffield. Don’t suppose that prohibits crowdfunding though. I’m sure he will be very grateful for any help in these difficult times
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote marigold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 13:41
I take a different view. There have been 2 rounds of prem 15s matches with no positive tests reported as a result of involvement in these matches. These players are not full time, have jobs outside of rugby and have and will not be tested prior to training or playing. Some of these matches took place in Tier 3 areas. There is no evidence that outdoor adapted rugby is anymore infection spreading than indoor pubs, restaurants, cafes which continue to be open under Tiers 3, 2 and 1. Most players will play at all levels because they want to play-the money has become secondary-mainly as they realise they will be getting none. I do not believe we will see a league season, it will be a series of local organised friendlies probably under the adapted laws. Players will play because they do not want to see their clubs disappear. All these players have been playing for years with the risk of catching flu and spreading it to a family member - how many has this stopped playing?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Halliford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 14:30
Great responses everyone! I’m actually firmly stuck to the fence on this. Our players want to play and many of them live in Central London so have been through a difficult lockdown. Yes, the Club is in Tier 2, I live 3 miles away and am in Tier 1 - thanks to the River Thames!!

I appreciate that it will be more difficult to get matches played in Tier 2 or 3 areas and even in Tier 1 areas managing spectators will be very difficult, although we can seat 150 socially distanced inside the Clubhouse for the Premiership Final so could have a small gate.

Players are not expecting to be paid for non-League matches. What we have done this summer is build a great camaraderie amongst them. The vibe is great, the fun and laughter immense and the work ethic outstanding. They just want to play the game they love. Whether they will get that opportunity sadly relies on an incompetent Government.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 16:02
Originally posted by marigold marigold wrote:

I take a different view. There have been 2 rounds of prem 15s matches with no positive tests reported as a result of involvement in these matches. These players are not full time, have jobs outside of rugby and have and will not be tested prior to training or playing. Some of these matches took place in Tier 3 areas. There is no evidence that outdoor adapted rugby is anymore infection spreading than indoor pubs, restaurants, cafes which continue to be open under Tiers 3, 2 and 1. Most players will play at all levels because they want to play-the money has become secondary-mainly as they realise they will be getting none. I do not believe we will see a league season, it will be a series of local organised friendlies probably under the adapted laws. Players will play because they do not want to see their clubs disappear. All these players have been playing for years with the risk of catching flu and spreading it to a family member - how many has this stopped playing?

Flu?

My word!  These were the types of things people were saying in March. Since then over 60k people have died with the prospect of many more and hospitals grinding to collapse.  Have you spoken to many people who’ve had this and ‘recovered’?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 16:03
Originally posted by Halliford Halliford wrote:

Great responses everyone! I’m actually firmly stuck to the fence on this. Our players want to play and many of them live in Central London so have been through a difficult lockdown. Yes, the Club is in Tier 2, I live 3 miles away and am in Tier 1 - thanks to the River Thames!!

I appreciate that it will be more difficult to get matches played in Tier 2 or 3 areas and even in Tier 1 areas managing spectators will be very difficult, although we can seat 150 socially distanced inside the Clubhouse for the Premiership Final so could have a small gate.

Players are not expecting to be paid for non-League matches. What we have done this summer is build a great camaraderie amongst them. The vibe is great, the fun and laughter immense and the work ethic outstanding. They just want to play the game they love. Whether they will get that opportunity sadly relies on an incompetent Government.

Just ensure they never vote for this government ever again
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WEvans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct 2020 at 16:39
Originally posted by Monkey Boy Monkey Boy wrote:

Originally posted by Halliford Halliford wrote:

Great responses everyone! I’m actually firmly stuck to the fence on this. Our players want to play and many of them live in Central London so have been through a difficult lockdown. Yes, the Club is in Tier 2, I live 3 miles away and am in Tier 1 - thanks to the River Thames!!

I appreciate that it will be more difficult to get matches played in Tier 2 or 3 areas and even in Tier 1 areas managing spectators will be very difficult, although we can seat 150 socially distanced inside the Clubhouse for the Premiership Final so could have a small gate.

Players are not expecting to be paid for non-League matches. What we have done this summer is build a great camaraderie amongst them. The vibe is great, the fun and laughter immense and the work ethic outstanding. They just want to play the game they love. Whether they will get that opportunity sadly relies on an incompetent Government.

Just ensure they never vote for this government ever again

That's all well and good until you look at the alternatives!
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