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Raider999 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 20:08
Originally posted by Camquin Camquin wrote:

If that happens at theend fo this non season - you are going to need to promote some National 1 sides.
If you do that, would it make sense to do the big reorganisation in this long off season - rather than waiting for 2022.


Personally, despite the need to get Saracens back in the top level (certainly not my way of thinking) I cannorpt see how the re-organisation can possibly go ahead without a full season of proper rugby so that all teams have an equal chance to play for their new position in the pyramid.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 00:29
I would say that if you were to promote an additional four  sides from Nat 1 to the Championship it would be Rosslyn Park, Rams Chinnor and Blackheath. There is a seven point gap from Club to Plymouth. While there were four games to go do you really think Albion would have closed that gap. Similarly, with six up if that is what is decided as there is a similar gap between Darlington and Elthamians.

Of course, I speak as a fan of a fast track side, Cambridge would have hoped to do better in Spring.

And no club would not be shut out indefinitely, both Plymouth and Darlington are a great clubs with excellent support - of course they would be in contention for promotion. Whether they were placed in a second National league or in a regional conference.

And as we do not expect the Championship to get any central funding - there would be no financial advantage to being in the higher league.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote castleparknight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 12:02
If there was any move to promote two teams this season I would expect, even demand, a legal challenge on the premise that insufficient notice was given, a full season was not played, and a rigged pool structure was created to attempt to facilitate a Saracens / Ealing play off (putting 12 balls with numbers on in a bag and drawing them out and leaving it to chance what pool you were in would be better and if Ealing and Saracens are in the same pool then Tango Sierra) 

I cannot see anything other than Saracens going up (highly likely unless the Knights can upset the apple cart Wink) and Warriors / Irish / Tigers or one of the other 3 lower ranked team (not to show any favour) coming down. Perhaps 2022 season will bring some stitch up arrangement.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote islander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 12:14
The ‘balls in bag’ approach would be less fair than the proposed arrangement with 1/3/5/7/9/11 in one pool & ‘even’ ranked teams in the other. Can CpK or anyone suggest a fairer method?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote islander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 12:16
Personally I doubt there will be anyone relegated from the Prem in 2021 & possibly for some time after that...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Blues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 20:36
Originally posted by islander islander wrote:

The ‘balls in bag’ approach would be less fair than the proposed arrangement with 1/3/5/7/9/11 in one pool & ‘even’ ranked teams in the other. Can CpK or anyone suggest a fairer method?

Although those league positions were made up, with a lot of games to go (7 I think). Blues for example had just started to pick up form and we were expecting a rise up the table having played both Ealing and Falcons twice with a 5 pointer guarantee against Yorkshire/Leeds.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kimbo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 22:46
Even if Sarries and Ealing had been in the same group, they probably would have gone for a top-two and semi final formula in an effort to ensure a similar final-tie scenario.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stalwart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Dec 2020 at 11:06
Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

Even if Sarries and Ealing had been in the same group, they probably would have gone for a top-two and semi final formula in an effort to ensure a similar final-tie scenario.

Neither team is invincible and they could well get turned over in away games at places like Jersey, Pirates, Bedford etc. In the first game of last season Pirates beat Ealing comfortably, so it could happen again.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kimbo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Dec 2020 at 13:15
Originally posted by Stalwart Stalwart wrote:

Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

Even if Sarries and Ealing had been in the same group, they probably would have gone for a top-two and semi final formula in an effort to ensure a similar final-tie scenario.

Neither team is invincible and they could well get turned over in away games at places like Jersey, Pirates, Bedford etc. In the first game of last season Pirates beat Ealing comfortably, so it could happen again.
I said 'in an effort to'.
We all know strange things happen.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Blues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Dec 2020 at 21:41
There have been a few COVID wins in the Premiership and European Cups... Newcastle were one of the ones to benefit from this. It probably increases the chances of the Premiership not having relegation but still promoting.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stalwart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2020 at 09:24
Originally posted by The Blues The Blues wrote:

There have been a few COVID wins in the Premiership and European Cups... Newcastle were one of the ones to benefit from this. It probably increases the chances of the Premiership not having relegation but still promoting.

But if the same thing happens when The Championship gets going would the same apply?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote marigold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2020 at 11:17
So the week before the Championship play off final Sarries have a mass outbreak of Covid-19, are unable to put a team out for either play off match and therefore Ealing are awarded the automatic promotion place.....discuss
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote castleparknight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2020 at 15:40
Tango Sierra Saracens btw it won't be Ealing it will be Donny Knights Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Magic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2020 at 16:08



Edited by Monkey Magic - 29 Dec 2020 at 16:51
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thatbloke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2020 at 16:15
"Panel" decisions haven't been used at any level to determine likely outcomes as far as I know so how could it be justified just to suit Saracens (and the rest of the Premiership)?
OR am I being naive? The two Covid games at the weekend were adjudged 4pts and 2pts so I wonder if that was to create a precedent for that very scenario should Saracens be affected down the line? 
On another note, if there is another team required in the Premiership and its all about who's got the most money then it should be opened up to anyone who wants to bid subject to meeting the necessary requirements regarding ground capacity and facilities etc so good luck to Ealing, Donny, Pirates et Al should they wish to be considered


Edited by Thatbloke - 29 Dec 2020 at 16:18
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WEvans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2020 at 16:35
Originally posted by Thatbloke Thatbloke wrote:

"Panel" decisions haven't been used at any level to determine likely outcomes as far as I know so how could it be justified just to suit Saracens (and the rest of the Premiership)?
OR am I being naive? The two Covid games at the weekend were adjudged 4pts and 2pts so I wonder if that was to create a precedent for that very scenario should Saracens be affected down the line? 
On another note, if there is another team required in the Premiership and its all about who's got the most money then it should be opened up to anyone who wants to bid subject to meeting the necessary requirements regarding ground capacity and facilities etc so good luck to Ealing, Donny, Pirates et Al should they wish to be considered

Well decisions were made by PRL to suit the Cheats for six years (letting them ignore the salary cap and keep the trophies they won by cheating) so it won't be any surprise if they more rules are ignored to get them back so they can carry on as usual. Sadly for anyone who wants the Premiership to have any credibility..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2020 at 20:22
Originally posted by WEvans WEvans wrote:

Originally posted by Thatbloke Thatbloke wrote:

"Panel" decisions haven't been used at any level to determine likely outcomes as far as I know so how could it be justified just to suit Saracens (and the rest of the Premiership)?
OR am I being naive? The two Covid games at the weekend were adjudged 4pts and 2pts so I wonder if that was to create a precedent for that very scenario should Saracens be affected down the line? 
On another note, if there is another team required in the Premiership and its all about who's got the most money then it should be opened up to anyone who wants to bid subject to meeting the necessary requirements regarding ground capacity and facilities etc so good luck to Ealing, Donny, Pirates et Al should they wish to be considered



Well decisions were made by PRL to suit the Cheats for six years (letting them ignore the salary cap and keep the trophies they won by cheating) so it won't be any surprise if they more rules are ignored to get them back so they can carry on as usual. Sadly for anyone who wants the Premiership to have any credibility..


Have to agree - everyone knew they were cheating, but by turning a blind eye the authorities created the finale outcome. Stamp down on it early and it would have been a slapped wrist and 5 or so point deduction.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stalwart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2020 at 21:02
Fact is that it was uncovered by a Daily Mail journalist - without that it would probably have been swept under the carpet.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KnightsBoy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 2020 at 07:07
Originally posted by Stalwart Stalwart wrote:

Fact is that it was uncovered by a Daily Mail journalist - without that it would probably have been swept under the carpet.

So so true, unfortunately....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 2020 at 12:48
Originally posted by Stalwart Stalwart wrote:

Fact is that it was uncovered by a Daily Mail journalist - without that it would probably have been swept under the carpet.


But anyone involved in Rugby knew they weren't legally below the salary cap for years - how could they be with the amount of internationals they kept adding to their squad.

When it was made general knowledge - the authorities were forced to act.

It speaks volumes that Saracens even then refused to open their books to the authorities and chose to take relegation instead (possibly a much lesser punishment than they might have got if they had?)- one wonders what else those books might have revealed?
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