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England v Scotland

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Donnyknightsfan View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Donnyknightsfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: England v Scotland
    Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 20:40
what have I just seen?. what an insane game of rugby. I know it was a draw but I think the moral victory must go to Scotland. why do England never seem to be able to switch the momentum of games when it is going against them. leadership is still a massive worry.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MikeGC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 21:21
Kudos to the Scots but it certainly feels like we lost
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote geralltrugby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 21:57
Good fun but both sides defensively awful. So many missed tackles and poor reads.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BP Youth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 13:41
England start well with a series of training ground moves, once they have been through the repertoire they look lost. Why kick the ball and cede possession when the opposition are on fire? Quite appalling tactics that wouldn't happen at fourth team level on the local park. 
It's only a game
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kingsheathlad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 13:56
Whatever was said at half time worked for Scotland but for England
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Donnyknightsfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 14:50
I really worry about this team for the world cup. the lack of an ability to switch to plan B is just startling. the players have to be able to adapt in games much quicker. I don't know who is to blame there, is it the players or the coach?. our mentality when put under pressure is just abysmal.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bigmal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 15:35
All valid but rather general comments given the amount of preparation time teams get and the large numbers of specialist coaches employed nowadays. For what they are worth here are my comments which will hopefully prompt an informed debate.

1. Farrell has looked jaded for a while now and is more inclined to switch the ball back inside rather than spread the play. That's not the first kick he's had charged down recently  but of greater concern was the interception of the pass. He's taking too much on and has become predictable especially as Youngs ( apparently our only scrum half) offers little in terms of a direct attacking threat.

2. Tualagi might have looked good against Italy but I wonder whether he's lost a yard of pace and is therefore less effective. His passing isn't great either.

3. Daly is quick BUT often seems to hesitate before opening up and is often tackled by his trailing foot. positionally he was caught out in defence yesterday.

4.The pundits and fans love Genge and Sinckler but unfortunately both players need to learn when to offload. Billy V was also lacking in this regard yesterday.

5. When Scotland started the s half recovery Eng needed to slow the game down and get back to basics. As in the Wales game they became tactically inept and Farrell must take his share of the blame ( and I like Farrell) as must EJ.

6. The game plan appears to be too stilted and the defence lacks the ferocity and discipline shown by Wales. Has EJ picked the right support team?

7. A comment was made by one commentator about the impressive fitness levels shown in training by Eng - surely last week should have been all about tactics and techniques NOT fitness training?

Wales played exceptionally well yesterday and there are a number of leader in the squad-the critical point for me was Parkes' tackle on Stockdale early on - had Ire equalised then things could have changed.

I look forward to hearing other views as this forum is so superior to HYS on the BBc.

WC could be interesting - I wonder if Ire's key players have all started to decline especially given te punishing international workload.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Eddie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 16:11
Spot on analysis Big Mal.

I am Welsh so obviously biased but England are flat track bullies. They are great when they are in the ascendancy but crumble when the pressure comes on. Warren Gatland has taken a long time to inculcate real belief and resilience into this Wales squad. They are never beaten except on the scoreboard which is the Kiwi way.

 England have the demons in their heads now, Eddie has a job on his hands 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Deva Delinquent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 16:18
I just don't think England have enough on-field leaders. They seem fine when things are going their way, but you only have to look at the second halves in the Wales and Scotland games to see when they are up against it there is no-one to inspire, re-focus, and generally lead when heads go down.

Another bugbear of mine is playing people out of position when there's no need. Daly at fullback; fantastic as an option through injury, but there are options there for people who play there for their respective clubs.

I think it's time to give the captaincy too someone else, take the pressure off Faz, let him concentrate on being a flyhalf.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bigmal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 18:19
Originally posted by Big Eddie Big Eddie wrote:

Spot on analysis Big Mal.

I am Welsh so obviously biased but England are flat track bullies. They are great when they are in the ascendancy but crumble when the pressure comes on. Warren Gatland has taken a long time to inculcate real belief and resilience into this Wales squad. They are never beaten except on the scoreboard which is the Kiwi way.

 England have the demons in their heads now, Eddie has a job on his hands 
 

Half Welsh myself Big Eddie but born and brought up in England so inclined towards the Red Rose - all fair comment though. I think EJ needs to look at his own management skills and ask whether he's on the ball.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bigmal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 18:38
Originally posted by Deva Delinquent Deva Delinquent wrote:

I just don't think England have enough on-field leaders. They seem fine when things are going their way, but you only have to look at the second halves in the Wales and Scotland games to see when they are up against it there is no-one to inspire, re-focus, and generally lead when heads go down.

Another bugbear of mine is playing people out of position when there's no need. Daly at fullback; fantastic as an option through injury, but there are options there for people who play there for their respective clubs.

I think it's time to give the captaincy too someone else, take the pressure off Faz, let him concentrate on being a flyhalf.
 

Fair point DD but who is up there ? In my opinion ,based on yesterday, Nowell,George and Kruis are the most committed and all are a captain's dream but none of them are international captains ( George may be in time). Tualagi,May and Daly are individuals and Youngs has lost his spark and become predictable so Farrell struggling with him on the inside and Tualagi ( not a great tactician/playmaker?) on the outside.

Up front props either inexperienced or introverted ( Cole) and flankers more effective but comparatively new to the team. Launchbury is no Alan W Jones ( although a decent player) and Billy V not a leader.

Of those missing Itoje is a little headstrong, Lawes somewhat volatile and the rest neither experienced or good enough to lead.

That doesn't leave much to choose from given that we DO NOT have a decent second/third string scrum half nor an experienced international class full back both positions being ideal for other leaders on the pitch. Its all very well blathering on about our "very own Jonah Lomu" when the player in question has done nothing yet other than look quite dangerous against Italy. Liam Williams eclipsed our backs when we played Wales and we need someone with his intelligence and the younger Mike Brown's positional sense and attitude.

Rant over - you can always send me a private message Eddie J !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Deva Delinquent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 19:18
Bigmal, it's tough all round to try and come up with a solution. I don't know who I'd have has captain - if pushed I'd go for Launchberry, but he doesn't always feature in Eddie's plans, but he's definitely a leader on the field. I agree mostly with the assessments of other players, but with the right coaching some could fit the bill of at least being motivators (Itoje).

I'd like to Cipriani in the squad. Think what you will, but for me is is a viable option at Fly Half and as a leader in general. Captain? Maybe not, definitely a leader though. But for whatever reason he just isn't in Eddie's plans.

Wales have done really well recently in ensuring they have leaders on the field to close out those close games. They believe in each other and don't give up, which is what England should be doing. You could argue that on paper Wales have the weaker side, but they BELIEVE. England just revert to self-destruction when Plan A fails.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote geralltrugby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 19:51
To concede six tries at home to a decimated Scotland is a disaster looking ahead to the WC. The demons are in the heads and all future opponents will be encouraged. Need to get past the myth that other nations try harder against England. It’s too convenient an excuse.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sid James Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 20:05
Just read TRP and was interested in Nick Cains Player Watch, where he scores the players out of 10.
Now, let's be fair, England dominated the 1st half and Scotland, as a whole, were rubbish. 2nd half, it's probably fair to say that analysis was reversed.
The England players scored between 5 to 6.5 with the exception of Tom Curry who scored 8, which is fair because he was the best player on the field for 80 mins.
The Scotland team, with the exception of 11. & 13. score higher at between 6 and 8 with Finn Russell getting a 9. for getting his act together in the 2nd half only.
With both teams only playing to their potential for 40 mins, I would have thought the scores would be more equal but, dear old Scotland won the 2nd half. Did that make Scotland the better team. Not in my opinion.

Nick Cain also picked his Lions team based on the 6 nation's. Not a Scotland player in the team or the reserves.

Edited by Sid James - 17 Mar 2019 at 22:25
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rabbie Burns Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 21:19
Right you may have guessed I have both feet firmly planted in the blue corner. On Tuesday I had a discussion where I stated that if we came within 50 of England it would be a result with our “weakened” side and on 34 minutes it looked like I predicted and volunteered to walk round to the shop returning just before the start of the second half and still cannot believe what I watched.
For me looking at the English performance it’s hard to decide whether it was ignorance or arrogance which caused their downfall. Even with the first 2 tries in the second half England failed to do what probably most people were calling for them to stop playing and slow the game down and keep the ball. If you consider Scotland’s next2 tries came from England trying to force the game, Farrell was charged down and then intercepted, where was the leadership of the pitch telling them to stop playing an expansive game and regain control..
That said it was almost great fun to watch but I wasn’t saying that at half time, made my Saturday night a lot brighter.
So many Christians not enough Lions
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sid James Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 22:30
Bigmal
"The pundits and fans love Genge and Sinckler but unfortunately both players need to learn when to offload"

Did you miss the excellent offload from Genge to Sinkler?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tigerburnie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 23:35
The first mistake was giving the Eddie Jones a job he can't do, he couldn't deliver for his own country and the second mistake was extending his contract. It is still not too late to send Skippy home, Scotland stood up to their coach and told him he was wrong at half time and look what happened, time for the English to do the same.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carlos fandango Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 06:48
Panic not!!

We've all played in or seen games where it is so easy you relax and let the oppo right back in. Then it's the devils job to get back up again.

The mistake, for me, that EJ made was not making wholesale substitutions when the wobble started or at about 55 mins. not 1s and 2s, bring 6 on with something to prove.

Still confident we lose in the semis to one of the southern 3 (or wales).



Edited by carlos fandango - 18 Mar 2019 at 06:50
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Bigmal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bigmal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 08:11
No Sid but neither did I miss Sinckler and Genge ignoring free men particularly the former-its not the offload in isolation that counts but the result.

Both players need to mature IMHO
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FHLH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 11:19
(i) Drop the entire squad bar Launchbury, Kruis, Curry, Nowell, Spencer and Daly
(ii) Bring in Cips and Goode
 
(iii) Launchbury as skipper
 
(iv) Celebrate the Women's amazing 12 try hammering of Scotland and winning the 6 Nations
 
(v) Remember that we whinge on and on about PRL funding and then get all upset about England's performance (which we have duly watched and roared on to victory - and Wales/Scotland/Ireland)
 
(vi) Interesting who Men's 6 Nations play for - what spread across 6 nations from PRL funding, if any


Edited by FHLH - 18 Mar 2019 at 11:22
"My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts."
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