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If this is happening in football...

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Richard Lowther View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Richard Lowther Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: If this is happening in football...
    Posted: 23 May 2019 at 18:31
What hope is there for rugby?

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/football-league/premier-league-epl-efl-league-one-two-championship-miguel-delaney-a8926126.html
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Clive Norling View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Clive Norling Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 May 2019 at 06:45
Originally posted by Richard Lowther Richard Lowther wrote:

What hope is there for rugby?

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/football-league/premier-league-epl-efl-league-one-two-championship-miguel-delaney-a8926126.html


Richard, worrying ......
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Loo fighters Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 May 2019 at 06:55
Evil, money & Route springs to mind. Gotta feel for the people involved at Bolton FC, but I fear it won't be the last. At a much lower level, it highlights Bees decision to "cut it's cloth" & have a club to support rather than chase a hollow dream. There's a cricket club in the Liverpool competition rapidly losing its sole & identity off the back of seasons paying it's 1st team circa 80k per season!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bigmal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 May 2019 at 08:10
Let us face it Reg Prem League and below is recognisable as the game played back in the 70/80's when amateur players trained harder and coaching was widespread. The current standard does NOT warrant paying players.

Nat 2 is a cut above and with the squads needed modest expenses and even "broken time" ( aaargh sacrilege but for some posters playing League is still akin to dining with the devil) payments make sense because people will pay to watch.

Nat 1 and Champs probably need a re-think.

If we ( the RFU) don't address the issue then the sport will die at the lower levels. I still run and running clubs have adapted assisted by that spectacular initiative the Park Run which shows most other sports up for what they have become namely self indulgent and self important. 

Rugby ( both codes) is about offering exercise to a huge range of players whilst encouraging camaraderie,self discipline and respect.How do we recover that spirit?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Insignificant Tick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 May 2019 at 13:28

Why not have the RFU set up leagues for clubs that declare themselves 100% amateur ?
Paying clubs then have their own leagues as well.
Players themselves can then choose which pathway to play in if they are good enough.
It might lead to players dropping out completely if they can't find a club to pay them but then they are not putting much back into the game anyway.
Top of the league but no money or bottom of the league but getting paid ?  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 May 2019 at 14:43
Because the old farts were playing in the amateur era when any cub that paid its players would be ostracised and any player who accepted payments would be banned for life - and they are well aware how much they were paid.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 May 2019 at 14:17
Originally posted by Insignificant Tick Insignificant Tick wrote:



Why not have the RFU set up leagues for clubs that declare themselves 100% amateur ?
Paying clubs then have their own leagues as well.
Players themselves can then choose which pathway to play in if they are good enough.
It might lead to players dropping out completely if they can't find a club to pay them but then they are not putting much back into the game anyway.
Top of the league but no money or bottom of the league but getting paid ? <span style="line-height: 1.4;"> </span>


I cannot believe that any club at level 4 or above doesn't pay its players, either directly or by arranging for third party benefactors to pay the players without it going through the club.

Either way the players are being paid (and rightly so in my view).

A return to amateur rugby would be a return to the days of cash in boots at the end of the game, which is in my opinion a dangerous path to follow, especially in these days of inland revenue cracking down on payments to sportsmen.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trench Foot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 May 2019 at 12:36
"I cannot believe that any club at level 4 or above doesn't pay its players, either directly or by arranging for third party benefactors to pay the players without it going through the club."

There is at least 1.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 May 2019 at 14:02
Originally posted by Trench Foot Trench Foot wrote:

<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">"I cannot believe that any club at level 4 or above doesn't pay its players, either directly or by arranging for third party benefactors to pay the players without it going through the club."</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">
</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">There is at least 1.</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">
</span>
<span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;">
</span>


Sorry, I didn't count Westcliff as they have yet to play a game at level 4.

If, as you suggest, none of the players receive any payment whatsoever it will be interesting to see how they go
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark W-J Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 May 2019 at 14:15
It may be a simplistic view, but LIWG - an amateur club - have consistently proved themselves to be too good for L5 and not good enough for L4, which to me indicates that this is the threshold where professionalism (or significant payments to players) kicks-in.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jester10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 May 2019 at 15:42
Originally posted by Mark W-J Mark W-J wrote:

It may be a simplistic view, but LIWG - an amateur club - have consistently proved themselves to be too good for L5 and not good enough for L4, which to me indicates that this is the threshold where professionalism (or significant payments to players) kicks-in.

I'd be amazed if LIWG didn't pay their players in some way shape or form, especially knowing a few of the players who play there. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cannon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 May 2019 at 17:13
Originally posted by Jester10 Jester10 wrote:

Originally posted by Mark W-J Mark W-J wrote:

It may be a simplistic view, but LIWG - an amateur club - have consistently proved themselves to be too good for L5 and not good enough for L4, which to me indicates that this is the threshold where professionalism (or significant payments to players) kicks-in.


I'd be amazed if LIWG didn't pay their players in some way shape or form, especially knowing a few of the players who play there. 
They definitely were paying players up to the end of the 2017/18 season.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bunkermentality Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 May 2019 at 09:31
I'd be amazed if LIWG didn't pay their players in some way shape or form, especially knowing a few of the players who play there. 
[/QUOTE] They definitely were paying players up to the end of the 2017/18 season.[/QUOTE]

LIWG tweet this week announces semi-pro contracts are on offer https://twitter.com/LondonIrishARFC/status/1132252897180311554 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark W-J Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 May 2019 at 20:30
Looks like I'm way too naive!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Surreyben Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2019 at 10:03
Originally posted by Mark W-J Mark W-J wrote:

It may be a simplistic view, but LIWG - an amateur club - have consistently proved themselves to be too good for L5 and not good enough for L4, which to me indicates that this is the threshold where professionalism (or significant payments to players) kicks-in.
 
The key point where LIWG changed policy I suspect was when they changed their name from London Irish Amateur to London Irish Wild Geese a couple of years back.
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