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N3L&SE relegation

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Maskedchicken View Drop Down
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    Posted: 20 Feb 2017 at 06:32
It looks like the top of N3L&SE is set. The top 5 have been sitting in their respective positions most of the year. But at the bottom anything could happen.

Are Southend appealing their points deduction?

Will Chichester have a similar deduction?

Shelford have reached the magic 10 wins but any of the teams from 7th to 12th could join Colchester & A&C who both seem resigned to the drop. Who do you think will succumb?
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chinese dave View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chinese dave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 2017 at 09:20
Much will hinge on any points deduction Chichester may receive, but as it stands I think it will be between Southend and Guildford, I think both Sutton and Westcliff are safe with both teams yet to play A & C and I can see Chichester winning another three games which will see them safe, but both Southend and Guildford have tough run ins with Wimbledon and Westcombe Park up next for Guildford and the last two matches for Southend are Tonbridge and Westcombe Park.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cannon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 2017 at 11:59
I can't see the third drop place being between anyone but Southend and Chichester, I think Chichester will survive as Southend have a much harder run in (even if Chichester get deducted points). Guildford do have a harder run in than Chichester, but either way won't get caught by Southend.

BTW someone who was down at Brighton last weekend was told the Chichester winger got 3 years ban, pure hearsay and maybe just Blues throwing petrol on the rumour!
Rucks and mauls may bust my balls, but whips and chains excite me!!
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Thames Estuary Man View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thames Estuary Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 2017 at 17:27
I think Chichester will be fine. They are playing well and have some winnable games still to come. The third relegation place in my opinion is between Southend and Guildford. I've only seen Guildford play once recently but they offered little that day except a very big/strong tight head so unless that was a bad day at the office they are going to struggle for more wins. Southend are good at home and have some winnable games to come but need a fantastic run in. They are trying to recruit, so will depend if they manage to buy themselves to saftey.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maskedchicken Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 2017 at 08:27
Originally posted by Thames Estuary Man Thames Estuary Man wrote:

Southend are good at home and have some winnable games to come but need a fantastic run in. They are trying to recruit, so will depend if they manage to buy themselves to saftey.


Really? Where did you hear this? Looks like the teams being put out recently are the local lads and not the recruits they had early season that didn't seem to work for them. Is recruiting really the way? Did you see Barking's result last week? Further fall from grace. If only they closed out the game against London Scottish those years back!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FEZ ANT PLUCKER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2017 at 15:22
Originally posted by Maskedchicken Maskedchicken wrote:

Originally posted by Thames Estuary Man Thames Estuary Man wrote:

Southend are good at home and have some winnable games to come but need a fantastic run in. They are trying to recruit, so will depend if they manage to buy themselves to saftey.


Really? Where did you hear this? Looks like the teams being put out recently are the local lads and not the recruits they had early season that didn't seem to work for them. Is recruiting really the way? Did you see Barking's result last week? Further fall from grace. If only they closed out the game against London Scottish those years back!

To see the once mighty Barking with Jason Leonard and more recently George Kruis, languishing in L1/L2 North is simply very sad indeed. What a fall from grace. Surely this epitomises the folly of paying players for success, paticularly when the benefactors dis-appear into the ether. Barking is not exactly located in the midst of public schools, but more predominantly placed in the heart of 'soccer' country, so their task of naturally recruiting talented players from the schools system is much harder. I understand they are building from the bottom up through their minis and juniors but the road will be long and hard and I wish them every success.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RedOrDead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2017 at 16:26
How do you know that this represents a fall from grace F A P? I have no idea where Barking found themselves in 1987 and we can only speculate as to where they would have been now if they had failed to embrace professionalism in 1995 coming from an area where competition for players is fierce from lots of other clubs with cash to spend. I suppose time will tell once structures are put into place to nurture and retain local talent.

The true folly is for a club to compromise its long term existence in the pursuit of success (read LW and Rugby of late), something that Barking didn't do. While someone is prepared to pay, it's for each club to decide whether this is a route that they wish to pursue. Doing so bought some good times to the club including winning N2S and coming within an interception try of level 2 rugby. Whether this is a sufficient prize to warrant some painful seasons in free fall and playing at the level they are now is for each club / committee member to decide. Particularly if they now find themselves at the level that they would have been at anyway, many may feel that the free fall was worth it.

IMO, Cornish Pirates are a perfect example of this. I don't think anyone is under any illusions that they are where they are now because of Dicky Evans and the money he has pumped into the club. Before his involvement, I believe that they were playing in the Cornwall & Devon league, at the time, just two leagues above the lowest league they could have found themselves in. Should the plug be pulled and they revert to amateur status, it seems likely that this is the level they would return to (Pirates Amateurs play at that level), but the club would be no worse off than it would have been before Evans' intervention and has the memories of silverware at Twickenham, a B&I cup win and two playoff finals to cherish.
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Thames Estuary Man View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thames Estuary Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2017 at 18:30
Originally posted by Maskedchicken Maskedchicken wrote:

Originally posted by Thames Estuary Man Thames Estuary Man wrote:

Southend are good at home and have some winnable games to come but need a fantastic run in. They are trying to recruit, so will depend if they manage to buy themselves to saftey.


Really? Where did you hear this? Looks like the teams being put out recently are the local lads and not the recruits they had early season that didn't seem to work for them. Is recruiting really the way? Did you see Barking's result last week? Further fall from grace. If only they closed out the game against London Scottish those years back!


I notice that Southend are advertising for 5 players on rugby agents.com
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FEZ ANT PLUCKER View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FEZ ANT PLUCKER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2017 at 20:01
I take onboard everything you say RorD and understand why you say it. Nothing ventured nothing gained...If you dont test the water you will never know... and all the other cliches etc etc. I look at it from a different angle and perspective. For most clubs at L5 and below the majority of their members/players are average club players who have shared friendship/competition/camaradery and mainly from being friends since mini/youth days. Occasionally some of these players have a bit more talent and get county and regional honours, but mainly remain loyal to their clubs and teammates. Very very occasionally these clubs get players of the calibre of Kruis, Daly, (my club) Launchbury, Marler and so on, who rise to the top level and no matter what money is bestowed to a club they will move on, but still remain loyal and faithful to their junior club and former mates. So imagine this situation, when suddenly a wealthy benefactor arrives with massive ego and bulging pockets, and invests in the club (probably for his own self interests) and then a whole host of better players arrive for pecuniary advantage, and the club move up the leagues. Imagine how the young average player feels to be ousted from contention by the arrival of these better players, especially if they have trained so hard to become a 1st XV player over many years. This must be soul destroying for the majority of club players. So the situation exists. I do not decry any club with ambition the opportunity to succeed and progress, but often, maybe too often it seems the ambition is tenuous, conditional and sometimes fragile, for as long as the benefactor dictates and controls the situation. If for any reason he withdraws his purse and the club have been totally reliant on his financial input, then the slippery slope begins and the journeymen dis-appear. Ideally clubs with ambition should have a business plan in place whereby they can survive independently regardless of the withdrawal of any major financial source. As for Barking I was merely commenting on how sad it is IMO to see them playing at such a lower level. FWIK they may be happy with life. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maskedchicken Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Mar 2017 at 21:14
The results this week really make life interesting at the bottom. Huge 5pt win for Southend. Chichester get Well beaten by Westcliff. Guildford probably realised it would be a tough day.

What are people's predictions now? Chichester have A&C, Guildford & Colcheater still to play but Southend 3 from last 4 seem to have momentum. Guildford in free fall, but A&C still to play.

I imagine Southend have spent some money & have experience on their side.

Chichester for relegation for me
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chinese dave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2017 at 06:20
Unless Southend have seriously recruited i can only see them winning two of their remaining games and likewise i can only see Guildford securing one more win, so it would be one of those two for the drop for me, Chichester have the easier run in and could well win three of their last five matches.
Westcliff are safe and Sutton and Dorking only need one more win each from the last five to stay out of trouble, and both have A&C to play.
It looks like we'll be joined next season by Sidcup (pleased for them, they've been close for the past three seasons) and Tring and  the play off winners from Havant v Brentwood (I'm hoping it's Havant, lovely pre match lunch and superb bar under the stand).
Relegation from National 2 could be one or two from Worthing, Barnes or London Iriish, dependent on how Wimbledon get on in their play off against the Nat SW3 runners up (Cambourne or Dings Crusaders)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Surreyben Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2017 at 09:20
Sadly given their form over the past 6 weeks or so, I'd be surprised if Camborne made second place to play Wimbledon now. Dings would be a fascinating challenge for the Dons!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maskedchicken Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2017 at 10:32
Surreyben...huh? Dings have won 1 of their last 4 and that being over lowly Lydney. Camborne only 2 out of last 4 but one loss against top of table Old Reds.

I'm not sure form comes into this right now. Anybodies for the taking.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maskedchicken Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Mar 2017 at 17:14
I look forward to the Dorking v Southend game this week. Southend seem to be on a roll, I'll be interested to see how they do away from Warners Bridge.

Guildford might be wise to rest some players and get fully healthy for the huge game they have with Colchester on 25th.

How many points needed for safety?

I think 45 or 46.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thames Estuary Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Mar 2017 at 22:37
Great win by Southend at Dorking in my opinion gives them a great chance of staying up at Guildford's expense.
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