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Griffin View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Griffin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 May 2019 at 10:53
Originally posted by tulip tulip wrote:

Do Penrith or Kendal not come into equation Griffin.
I suppose not now that Blaydon Alnwick and Morpeth are in North Premiership


The full list of my calculations for mileage from N1W to N1E is:-

Original League dist to:-N1EReduced by 2%Regarded as Identical
Altrincham Kersal RFC2380
Burnage RFC23822334.3YES
Broughton Park FC24042355.7YES
Stockport RUFC24252376.3YES
Bowdon RUFC24542404.9NO
Warrington RUFC25342483.6NO
Wilmslow RUFC25452494.1NO
Kendal RFC26082555.8NO
Penrith RFC27122657.4NO
Northwich RFC28462789.4NO
Vale of Lune RUFC28632806.1NO
Birkenhead Park RFC29832923.2NO
Firwood Waterloo RFC30082947.5NO
Keswick RFC31683104.3NO
Douglas (I.O.M.) RFC47004605.6NO

Penrith & Kendal are well down the list.



Edited by Griffin - 05 May 2019 at 10:54
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself and you are the easiest person to fool." Richard Feynman. God = √-1.
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MikeGC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MikeGC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 May 2019 at 12:37
The scuttlebut I’ve heard is that Stockport might fancy volunteering.
They feel N1E could be an easier route into North Prem
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thatbloke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 May 2019 at 15:30
Just throwing this in there but if there are no volunteers and a club is "invited" to cross over to NE who didn't want to might that club be tempted to join the Lancashire revolution to avoid all the travelling (especially as there appears to be an open invitation to the mutineers to return to the fold at there previous level!?)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Injuredout Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 May 2019 at 20:11
What do people mean by the Lancashire revolution?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thatbloke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 May 2019 at 20:25
Not sure that is a serious question but if it is you are obviously not aware of the group of Lancashire clubs (24ish) who opted out of the RFU League pyramid last season to avoid excess travelling particularly to Cumbria every other week. 2 leagues, very much social rugby but some decent clubs involved - Widnes, Wigan etc
The 2 leagues are called Lancashire Premier & Lancashire Division 1 made up of a selection of Level 7, 8 & 9 clubs
Whilst remaining as members of the RFU, results and tables etc are not published on the RFU results pages

Edited by Thatbloke - 05 May 2019 at 20:35
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Griffin View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Griffin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 May 2019 at 21:42
I think if you put 'Lanc' in the search box for 'Competition' on the RFU results page one of the options is 'Lancashire County Rugby Union Leagues'. Click on this and up come the results.


The results also show on their website:-




Edited by Griffin - 05 May 2019 at 21:50
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself and you are the easiest person to fool." Richard Feynman. God = √-1.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bigmal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2019 at 06:54
Spot on as usual G - as has been pointed out some well established clubs electing to take this route. Is there any feedback regarding the pros and cons? Seems to me if you can mix the social and competitive elements then playing could be attractive to a wider range if individuals.

As for the possibility of Stockoort electing to transfer across I cant be of assistance although they do have ready access to the W - E motorway network.it is the AGM soon so things should become clearer sooner rather than later.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Injuredout Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2019 at 09:15
Thanks, I was kind of aware the idea and appreciate the extra detail (for me) 👍
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Injuredout Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2019 at 09:16
👍
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Injuredout Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2019 at 09:20
I suspect it’s important to know what you want to be as a rugby club, and to be clear about that to the players you want to attract and keep.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Darth Vadar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2019 at 19:58
There were 20 clubs (2 divisions of 10) who decided to go their own after years of discussions about the vexed subject of long distance travel. Of course, this number may well increase in the not-too-distant future as applications for entry into next seasons competition are currently out. 

The ADM Premier League has been very competitive and the description of playing mainly social rugby is not one that many supporters would recognise. In fact, the league Champions were only determined on the final Saturday of the regular season after a tense four way struggle.

Personally, I think the genie is already out of the bottle as far as the issue of long distance travel is concerned, and with no solution in sight, I can only see an increasing number of clubs across the country eventually deciding to make the switch to more localised leagues. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bigmal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2019 at 20:54
Thanks DV most helpful. Perhaps things will change - any feedback about depth of clubs ie do they run 2 and 3 teams? Many of those sides ran at least 4 teams back in the 20th C.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Griffin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2019 at 21:42
I happen to be intimately involved with the fixtures for the NOWIRUL leagues so the information on team numbers is readily accessible.

I think that a reduction in the number of teams is fairly common these days. My club ran 5 teams 3 years ago but is now down to 3. Sale FC used to run 6 teams. They had a 2nd team in the NOWIRUL leagues but dropped out so are now down to 1 team. Wilmslow started the season with 3 teams but were down to 1 by the end of the season.

ADM Lancashire County Rugby Union Leagues

PremierDivision 1
Aldwinians4teamsAshton-Under-Lyne2teams
Didsbury Toc H3 was 4teamsBurnley2teams
Heaton Moor3teamsBury3teams
Littleborough3teamsClitheroe2teams
Liverpool St Helens3teamsEagle1teams
Oldham3teamsManchester Medics1teams
Trafford MV3teamsNorth Manchester2teams
Tyldesley1 was 2teamsOrmskirk2teams
West Park (St Helens)3teamsThornton Cleveleys2teams
Widnes3teamsWigan2teams


Edited by Griffin - 07 May 2019 at 09:38
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself and you are the easiest person to fool." Richard Feynman. God = √-1.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camp Freddie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2019 at 08:40
Firstly, by virtue of the fact that no ADM Lancashire League clubs have opted to rejoin the RFU pyramid shows its popularity with players.
Secondly, whilst not yet having enough players for extra teams, the clubs generally are saying that they have a bigger pool of players making themselves available for selection. Certainly would make the life of a third team captain easier on a saturday morning.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Griffin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2019 at 09:36
Originally posted by Camp Freddie Camp Freddie wrote:

Firstly, by virtue of the fact that no ADM Lancashire League clubs have opted to rejoin the RFU pyramid shows its popularity with players.

I know of a least one club joining the ADM Lancashire Leagues from the NOWIRUL leagues. Interesting that they chose the ADM leagues and not the RFU leagues.

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself and you are the easiest person to fool." Richard Feynman. God = √-1.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Injuredout Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2019 at 09:50
Originally posted by Darth Vadar Darth Vadar wrote:

There were 20 clubs (2 divisions of 10) who decided to go their own after years of discussions about the vexed subject of long distance travel. Of course, this number may well increase in the not-too-distant future as applications for entry into next seasons competition are currently out. 

The ADM Premier League has been very competitive and the description of playing mainly social rugby is not one that many supporters would recognise. In fact, the league Champions were only determined on the final Saturday of the regular season after a tense four way struggle.

Personally, I think the genie is already out of the bottle as far as the issue of long distance travel is concerned, and with no solution in sight, I can only see an increasing number of clubs across the country eventually deciding to make the switch to more localised leagues. 



Sounds like an interesting piece of evolution. Has anyone got any sense of whether travel times to away games have been uppermost in players minds when they decide to stay with or join a club vs staying with or joining a club where travel is more onerous (and expensive)?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2019 at 10:38
I think it is worse in Lancashire because of the number of Manchester and Liverpool clubs and the small number uf Cumbrian clubs - there is a significant rise in travel on promotion to the league and then a drop in travel if you get promoted again - as you go into Yorkshire.

There is no good solution for the Cumbrian clubs and cost has fallen on the Manchester clubs.
You could put them in a league with the Newcastle clubs - but that has just as much travel.
Or you can put them in a league of their own - but there are not enough of them unless the play each other multiple times.

Or you could completely overhaul the pyramid and move from two leagues feeding into one to three or four. This would reduce the number of sides travelling outside their county. But it would lead to bigger gaps between leagues and in general - though not everywhere and Lancashire may be the exception - more mismatches.

But expecting the RFu to do anything that actually requires listening to what clubs want and carefully thinking about compromises is utterly unlikely.

We would end up with another version of the adult game review where they did exactly the wrong thing, got shot down and then drafted something on a fag packet and sent it out without updating the figures from the first version having dodged all the actually difficult decisions leaving them to the CBs.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2019 at 10:41
Originally posted by Camp Freddie Camp Freddie wrote:

Firstly, by virtue of the fact that no ADM Lancashire League clubs have opted to rejoin the RFU pyramid shows its popularity with players.
Secondly, whilst not yet having enough players for extra teams, the clubs generally are saying that they have a bigger pool of players making themselves available for selection. Certainly would make the life of a third team captain easier on a saturday morning.


Why would they rejoin after a year?
The clubs in it have opted for rugby with less regulation and of a less competitive nature.
There’s still been games not being fulfilled and there’s also been one sided games.

Take a club like Widnes - what difference has it made to them as opposed to being in South Lancashire/Cheshire 1?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Earl.gray Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2019 at 11:21
Originally posted by Griffin Griffin wrote:

Originally posted by Camp Freddie Camp Freddie wrote:

Firstly, by virtue of the fact that no ADM Lancashire League clubs have opted to rejoin the RFU pyramid shows its popularity with players.


I know of a least one club joining the ADM Lancashire Leagues from the NOWIRUL leagues. Interesting that they chose the ADM leagues and not the RFU leagues.



That club must have no ambition. And joining the lancs league instead of the rfu is because the club knows they’ll get a hiding every week in the rfu leagues.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CalderVale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2019 at 12:15
Which club is leaving norwirl?
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