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Championship Players in the Premiership

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Forum Name: The Championship
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Printed Date: 21 Oct 2020 at 02:43
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Topic: Championship Players in the Premiership
Posted By: gerg_861
Subject: Championship Players in the Premiership
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 10:00
Forum is a bit quiet, so I thought that I'd comment on the closest thing to Championship action at the moment: former Championship players in the Premiership.

Personally, I'm quite liking the mid-week fixtures as they are forcing the teams to go deeper into their squad and ensuring that the Championship players don't just sit on the bench or play A league games (which don't exist this year anyhow).

I'm mostly aware of the Ealing players that have moved up, and here's how I thought they've done so far:

Matt Cornish: He's played in, I believe, all of the games for Irish. He managed a driving maul try as a replacement in his first match, started in the second and played well but couldn't finish a particularly good opportunity on a rolling maul in the second and came on relatively late in the third and fourth. Overall, he's looked like a solid player, but hasn't been tearing up trees. 6/10.

Harry Sloan: He came on for a few minutes in one game for Sarries and was fine. Too early to score.

Jordy Reid: If there's anyone who has been impacted negatively by the focus on the breakdown, it has been Jordy. He's gotten pinged for quite a number of penalties, most of which wouldn't have been called last year, and some of which were just plain wrong. He's started once and came on as a replacement (late) twice. He had one billing steal, break, and chip that was ruined by a wing failing to dot down. 5/10

Jordan Els: Hasn't played for Quins.

Craig Trenier: Hasn't played for Quins.

Outside of Ealing, I've only seen Will Hooley get much playing time, but I'll let Blues fans comment on him.





Replies:
Posted By: Runitback
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 10:47
Craig Trenier - injured, so has not been available.

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Run with it


Posted By: Bombay Duck
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 12:27
Blair Cowan ex Pirate, gets plenty of game time with Irish


Posted By: Mark W-J
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 12:51
Lovejoy Chawatama has mainly been coming off the bench for London Irish, while Barney Maddison is lucky to even make it onto the bench in the first place.
Josh McNally has established himself as a starter at Bath.
Jonah Holmes, Greg Bateman and Will Spencer were all fairly regular starters for Leicester, but all three have left during the lockdown.  The first two have moved to Wales, but Spencer has had one game for Bath since the resumption.


Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 13:01
Originally posted by Runitback Runitback wrote:

Craig Trenier - injured, so has not been available.

Ah - wasn't aware of this. That'll explain it.

And for clarity, I was just commenting on folks who left at the end of last season. Otherwise, I'd add that Piers O'Connor has looked absolutely awful at Bristol this year, and that's after he looked good enough last year to earn a non-capped appearance against the Baa Baas.


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 13:41
This year we've had Stokes go to Irish, Kessell to Bris, Wallace to Leicester. Don't expect any of them to get all that many minutes TBH. 
Purdy obviously went to Glaws with some success.
Forsyth and Jennings are also on loan at Leicester until the end of the current Prem season.


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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: Raider999
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 13:44
Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

This year we've had Stokes go to Irish, Kessell to Bris, Wallace to Leicester. Don't expect any of them to get all that many minutes TBH. 
Purdy obviously went to Glaws with some success.
Forsyth and Jennings are also on loan at Leicester until the end of the current Prem season.


Puffy left Gloucester, went to Coventry - currently at Bristol and doing quite well.

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RAID ON


Posted By: maire23
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 14:02
Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

This year we've had Stokes go to Irish, Kessell to Bris, Wallace to Leicester. Don't expect any of them to get all that many minutes TBH. 
Purdy obviously went to Glaws with some success.
Forsyth and Jennings are also on loan at Leicester until the end of the current Prem season.

Luke Wallace has had some decent minutes at Tigers. 


Posted By: Cov kid 42
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 14:17
The point that needs hammering hear to the blazers at the RFU is that, contrary to what they came out with when announcing the cutbacks to the Premiership, as we all know in the Championship, the Division is producing quality which has & is going on to play a part in the Premiership.
It might be an idea if for once they swallowed pride & admitted their statement was wrong.


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John Butler


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 15:49
Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

This year we've had Stokes go to Irish, Kessell to Bris, Wallace to Leicester. Don't expect any of them to get all that many minutes TBH. 
Purdy obviously went to Glaws with some success.
Forsyth and Jennings are also on loan at Leicester until the end of the current Prem season.


Puffy left Gloucester, went to Coventry - currently at Bristol and doing quite well.
Yes, I know. Brain fart.
Bit like calling him 'Puffy' I guess.


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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: cheshire exile
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 17:16
TJ Harris, Jersey hooker, on loan to Wasps after they lost two hookers to injury in their win against Bath.
Sam Matavesi has been coming off the bench for Saints, has committed one howler which cost them a try unfortunately Cry


Posted By: Raider999
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2020 at 17:29
Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

This year we've had Stokes go to Irish, Kessell to Bris, Wallace to Leicester. Don't expect any of them to get all that many minutes TBH. 
Purdy obviously went to Glaws with some success.
Forsyth and Jennings are also on loan at Leicester until the end of the current Prem season.


Puffy left Gloucester, went to Coventry - currently at Bristol and doing quite well.

Yes, I know. Brain fart.
Bit like calling him 'Puffy' I guess.


If you key in Purdy and don't notice it changes it to Puffy - I really can't stand predictive text.

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RAID ON


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2020 at 09:24
So don't use it. I never, ever do.

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: southerngit
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2020 at 12:14
Another Rotherham old boy signed by Saracens, this time Robin 'Bomber' Hislop.


Posted By: KnightsBoy
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2020 at 14:13
From Donny
Marc Thomas to Quins
Bomber hislop to Saracens

Tom James Northampton 
(Paul Hill and Piers Francis been there a few years)

Will Griff John at Sale

Pete Luco ck  to Newcastle

Jake Armstrong (via Jersey) at Bristol

Michael Heaney at Worcester


Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2020 at 14:51
Originally posted by KnightsBoy KnightsBoy wrote:

From Donny
Marc Thomas to Quins
Bomber hislop to Saracens

Tom James Northampton 
(Paul Hill and Piers Francis been there a few years)

Will Griff John at Sale

Pete Luco ck  to Newcastle

Jake Armstrong (via Jersey) at Bristol

Michael Heaney at Worcester

Any view on how they are doing?


Posted By: KnightsBoy
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2020 at 15:02
Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Originally posted by KnightsBoy KnightsBoy wrote:

From Donny
Marc Thomas to Quins
Bomber hislop to Saracens

Tom James Northampton 
(Paul Hill and Piers Francis been there a few years)

Will Griff John at Sale

Pete Luco ck  to Newcastle

Jake Armstrong (via Jersey) at Bristol

Michael Heaney at Worcester

Any view on how they are doing?

Heaney was getting plenty of game time
Will Griff John playing regular

Tom James came off bench for Saints two weeks ago
Marc and bomber just signed on temp contracts

Piers and Paul are regular players, Piers as gone on to play for England

Also we had Lewis  Tomas Francis now at Exeter, plus Jack Yeandle both regular starters over recent years


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2020 at 12:07
Will Goodrick-Clarke(prop) has either started or come off the bench at London Irish at least four times this season. He was at Richmond for several years.

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pappashanga


Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2020 at 13:04
Originally posted by KnightsBoy KnightsBoy wrote:

Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Originally posted by KnightsBoy KnightsBoy wrote:

From Donny
Marc Thomas to Quins
Bomber hislop to Saracens

Tom James Northampton 
(Paul Hill and Piers Francis been there a few years)

Will Griff John at Sale

Pete Luco ck  to Newcastle

Jake Armstrong (via Jersey) at Bristol

Michael Heaney at Worcester

Any view on how they are doing?

Heaney was getting plenty of game time
Will Griff John playing regular

Tom James came off bench for Saints two weeks ago
Marc and bomber just signed on temp contracts

Piers and Paul are regular players, Piers as gone on to play for England

Also we had Lewis  Tomas Francis now at Exeter, plus Jack Yeandle both regular starters over recent years

Tom James started last night against Bristol, and although Northampton got utterly lumped, it wasn't due to any mistakes from Tom. Also Garside from Ampthill came on as a replacement and was fine, putting in one very clever carry.


Posted By: maire23
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2020 at 14:12
Karl Garside was also on loan at Nottingham at one point. 


Posted By: Halliford
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2020 at 16:12
London Irish tonight field Ross Neal, Ben Donnell, Jack Cooke, Isaac Curtis-Harris, Ben Atkins and Izzy Moore-Aiono, all of whom have had time in recent seasons with Esher while Harlequins field Cadan Murley, James Lang, Will Collier, Archie White and Ross Chisholm, all of whom had time with Esher. The D/R system works well in London!


Posted By: marigold
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2020 at 20:09
But would you say it has worked well for Esher? Is one of the club's primary aims to develop Premiership Academy players?


Posted By: islander
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2020 at 20:55
Edits in bold

Jersey Reds' contribution
  • Wasps: Rowlands (DR), Le Booj (via Blues), TJ Harris (short-term loan)
  • Gloucester: Banahan (via Bath & L Irish - never played in Ch'ship), Beckett
  • Wuss: Van Breda, Howe (DR)
  • Brizz: Woolmore, Armstrong, Sheedy (DR)
  • Quins: Herron, Thomas (via Donny), Kerrod (via Wuss)
  • Sarries: Barrington, Clarey, Venter
  • Exeter: Taione; Williams
  • Irish: Rogerson
  • Sale: our Asst Coach Rob Webber, signed from Sale in June, has gone back there on short-term loan. I realise that doesn't exactly make him a 'Championship player'...
The 3 DRs listed all spent at least half a season here, up to a season in some cases.

I have probably missed some out and/or failed to recall players at Bath, Leicester (apart from Charlie Clare who was here for half a season in 2012/13 but spent far longer at Bedford before going to Saints & eventually back to Tigers), Saints


Posted By: corporalcarrot
Date Posted: 10 Sep 2020 at 08:13
Originally posted by islander islander wrote:

Jersey Reds' contribution
  • Wasps: Rowlands (DR), Le Booj (via Blues), TJ Harris (short-term loan)
  • Gloucester: Banahan (via L Irish), Beckett
  • Wuss: Van Breda, Howe (DR)
  • Brizz: Woolmore, Armstrong, Sheedy (DR)
  • Quins: Herron, Thomas (via Donny), Kerrod (via Wuss)
  • Sarries: Barrington, Clarey, Venter
  • Exeter: Taione
  • Irish: Rogerson
  • Sale: our Asst Coach Rob Webber, signed from Sale in June, has gone back there on short-term loan. I realise that doesn't exactly make him a 'Championship player'...
The 3 DRs listed all spent at least half a season here, up to a season in some cases.

I have probably missed some out and/or failed to recall players at Bath, Leicester, Saints

Not Premiership but a couple of Scrum halves with Scarlets & a couple of forwards with Edinburgh - Falcons players may eventually be added when the new season starts. Charlie Clare (via Blues) was playing in the televised game last night.


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Dont kick it. Pick it up and GO FORWARD.


Posted By: Les E
Date Posted: 10 Sep 2020 at 08:40
Originally posted by islander islander wrote:

Jersey Reds' contribution
  • Wasps: Rowlands (DR), Le Booj (via Blues), TJ Harris (short-term loan)
  • Gloucester: Banahan (via L Irish), Beckett
  • Wuss: Van Breda, Howe (DR)
  • Brizz: Woolmore, Armstrong, Sheedy (DR)
  • Quins: Herron, Thomas (via Donny), Kerrod (via Wuss)
  • Sarries: Barrington, Clarey, Venter
  • Exeter: Taione
  • Irish: Rogerson
  • Sale: our Asst Coach Rob Webber, signed from Sale in June, has gone back there on short-term loan. I realise that doesn't exactly make him a 'Championship player'...
The 3 DRs listed all spent at least half a season here, up to a season in some cases.

I have probably missed some out and/or failed to recall players at Bath, Leicester, Saints

Harry Williams: Exeter & England


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"Rugby is not just a sport, It’s a way of life"


Posted By: maire23
Date Posted: 10 Sep 2020 at 09:15
Harry Williams also played for Nottingham. 



Posted By: billesleyexile
Date Posted: 10 Sep 2020 at 10:04
I do think that there's got to be a qualitative difference in terms of "contribution" between:

- 'came through our M&J then spent a couple of years in the firsts'
- 'came through our M&J then left to go to a prem academy'
- 'played a few games for us on D/R'
- 'turned up on the scene fully formed, played for us and left for the Prem'
- etc

Sometimes when I sit and look at Moseley's list I wonder which ones we can actually claim and whether we're trying to tell ourselves stories with some of them because it sounds good 

With someone like Lewis Bean - who went from us in N1 to Saints and is now getting at least regular bench starts (as indeed he did this week), then he'd apparently never played rugby before someone put a ball in his hand in the army, then he came to us for a couple of seasons, then off to Saints. So I suppose we split the honours with the army in terms of his (rapid) development? But then again, given how rapid it was, maybe he was just a natural? And then Worcester would chip in and say 'while he was at Moseley he was training with us sometimes and played the odd A League match, so where's our credit?'

For a lot of players there has been genuine development, and hard work, but I always wonder how much ice there is below the surface in these lists of contributions, where it amounts to 'he wore our shirt'?




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keep the faith


Posted By: islander
Date Posted: 12 Sep 2020 at 09:06
I'd add another category to your's above - player who came to club (Jersey in this case) having been on the books of a top-flight club but not really making an impression there, developing their game in the Championship and then earning a second crack at the higher level. From Jersey alumni you could include the 2 scrum-halves mentioned by the Corporal - Hardy 'n' Homer at Scarlets in this category, as well as Rogerson (Irish), Herron (Quins), Woolmore (Bristol) and Clare (Leicester). Not claiming all the credit for the last 2 - Woolmore played for Taunton & Clare was with Blues far longer than he was here (5ish months IIRC, debut was Leinster [a] on his 21st birthday)


Posted By: cheshire exile
Date Posted: 12 Sep 2020 at 18:02
You could add to that Dave Ward, didn’t quite make it as flanker at Wasps and Saints, came to Pirates as a hooker, went onto be q huge success and Quins and England Saxons. Quins were I believe tipped off by centre Matt Hooper who came to us from Plymouth Albion and left us for the Stoop.


Posted By: Peter_B
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2020 at 11:17
Sheedy played for Bristol in the Championship. As did Uren and Eadie. 

Mind you Saracens have Mako as an academy graduate when he was in Bristol’s academy and had played forty games for Bris before they signed him.


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2020 at 12:32
Sheedy used to play regularly for Cinderford as a DR some years ago. Noticeably talented but a terrible goal kicker, which has now improved.

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pappashanga


Posted By: Peter_B
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2020 at 18:45
Alec Clarey has appeared as a Saracens player. He was also part of Bristol’s academy. Not sure if he played for Bris in Championship but has for Jersey.


Posted By: front5
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2020 at 19:44
I dont believe core player progession is gained at the championship level.... there are senior players who make the step up from the championship however i believe more Premiership teams send their youngsters to National 1 and 2 to blood in so to speak....  looking purely at DMP in very recent times you have -

Josh Hodge
Morgan Passman 
Adam Brocklebank
Will Montgomery 
Contact Cade
Rob Farrar
Tom Marshall
Cameron Nordli-Kelementi
Jack Payne

It would be better name the players who have broken the mould and create/forged themselves an opportunity at a later stage in their careers.... so again looking at DMP -

Adam Radwan released from Falcons at 16 joined DMP set the league alight and will probably pull on an England shirt in the next 2 year

Matt Shields- Prop moving to Quins in late 20s

Matt Heaton - Canadas player of the year and played everyminute of the world Cup playing for a USA franchise (mega money i would giess) in late 20s

Simon Uzokwe - a medical student as sunderland uni signing a pro contract at early 20s

Frano Lamanna - Uruguay world Cup player playing in pro 14

Luca Petillo - one if the hardest men I've ever met again playing pro 14

Santiago Socino - from DMP to Jaguars and 2nd choice hooker for Argentina 

These are the types of players we should be commenting on not DR'S and they were selected and placed in the said club to develop for the Premiership team....

If we really turned back the clock in the mid 2000s Toby Flood was offered to DMP as the answer to Kevin Oliphants injury and was places on the wing as he didn't make the cut at the time??? That was Nat 3 north



Posted By: corporalcarrot
Date Posted: 15 Sep 2020 at 11:37
Originally posted by Peter_B Peter_B wrote:

Alec Clarey has appeared as a Saracens player. He was also part of Bristol’s academy. Not sure if he played for Bris in Championship but has for Jersey.
Clarey came off the bench for the last 10 mins in Jersey's last away game at Briz. Jersey's starting props that day were Woolmore & Armstrong who both moved to Briz that year. Sarries recently had Barrington & Clarey in their front row - so many cracking front row players over the years - Williams and Lockwood were incredible as was Brennan who made the Championship dream team and still around in St Ouens.

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Dont kick it. Pick it up and GO FORWARD.


Posted By: Westcoaster
Date Posted: 18 Sep 2020 at 09:05
Pierce Philips was another Jersey Red who made the Prem 

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Come on Jersey........


Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 22 Sep 2020 at 22:38
Happened to pick up a copy of Rugby World today and there was an interview with Eddie Jones in there. He was asked "Who are the best young players in the Premiership?" and he reeled off half a dozen names, then he said "...What's also noticeable is the number of players coming through from the Championship and doing well. It's really showing how many good players went there and took their opportunity."

Whatever else is stacked against the Championship at the moment (and there's plenty), it is clear that Eddie Jones is a major supporter, not just from this quote, but from things like going to Ealing to train the team.


Posted By: PlangentThrowback
Date Posted: 23 Sep 2020 at 08:21
Originally posted by corporalcarrot corporalcarrot wrote:

Jersey's starting props that day were Woolmore & Armstrong who both moved to Briz that year.

Woolmore illustrates the point above about experience gained further down the pyramid than the Championship.  He was at Taunton for several seasons, plus a brief Exeter connection.  All before Jersey.  And now more game for Bris (does the 's' really sound like 'z'?).  Who developed him?  All of them.  I suspect the man himself may have but a bit of effort in too.


Posted By: corporalcarrot
Date Posted: 25 Sep 2020 at 11:25
Originally posted by PlangentThrowback PlangentThrowback wrote:

[QUOTE=corporalcarrot]And now more game for Bris (does the 's' really sound like 'z'?).  
No offence intended with my use of "z" and although in the unlikely event that Jersey play the Bears again I would be hoping for a second win for Jersey in the prem I tend to follow Bears and Falcons and a signed Bristol shirt hangs proudly in my Rugby snug at home where Mrs C banishes me to watch matches. I think the z probably derives from a rugby tour to Weston & Burnham in the late 1980s when it seemed to my deficient hearing to sound like Brizzle.  

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Dont kick it. Pick it up and GO FORWARD.


Posted By: Bartman
Date Posted: 28 Sep 2020 at 08:57
There's no offence taken with the use of the "z" in theze here parts my good friend and you are always more than welcome to come over to visit us in Briztol any time. 
Maybe not if your team spoil our unbeaten run again though, but so happy for you that you went away with your wish the last time. Beer


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Posted By: islander
Date Posted: 28 Sep 2020 at 19:47
Originally posted by Bartman Bartman wrote:

There's no offence taken with the use of the "z" in theze here parts my good friend and you are always more than welcome to come over to visit us in Briztol any time. 
Maybe not if your team spoil our unbeaten run again though, but so happy for you that you went away with your wish the last time. Beer

Good to hear Bartman - cheerz to you too Beer

if zomeone wants to get all upzet about a jokey zwitch of conzonant they pozzibly need to go to the nearezt pub & order a large glazz of perzpective...


Posted By: RedPete
Date Posted: 29 Sep 2020 at 13:20
Originally posted by PlangentThrowback PlangentThrowback wrote:

Originally posted by corporalcarrot corporalcarrot wrote:

Jersey's starting props that day were Woolmore & Armstrong who both moved to Briz that year.

Woolmore illustrates the point above about experience gained further down the pyramid than the Championship.  He was at Taunton for several seasons, plus a brief Exeter connection.  All before Jersey.  And now more game for Bris (does the 's' really sound like 'z'?).  Who developed him?  All of them.  I suspect the man himself may have but a bit of effort in too.

I believe that Jake just turned up at Taunton to try his luck at a higher level, having played a while in the Yeovil/Sherborne area (though I think he is a Londoner by birth). It wasn't long before he was on Exeter's radar. You are not wrong to suggest he put in a bit of effort himself, a very hard working young man.
When not on duty at Exeter/Jersey he would sometimes turn up and perform water duties for Taunton, we are very proud of his achievements.


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Schadenfreude - such a big word for something so small-minded


Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 04 Oct 2020 at 13:12
Nice article about Matt Cornish in the Rugby Paper today. He looked really good for Irish against Exeter in the midweek game, with a very nifty break and a try in open play. Matt came through the Ealing academy, so I think he'd fulfill all but the most stringent interpretation of a Championship grown player (I think he did his minis elsewhere).

Another Ealing player got his Prem debut in the midweek games, with Jordan Els getting a run out for Quins. He came on after Quins had already lost a player to a red card, but he didn't look great. On two occasions I saw team mates need to shove him to the right spot on the defensive line - but I only caught the condensed highlights, so might have missed something else. He spent two years in Ealing, coming from South Africa, but really improved his ball handling.


Posted By: PlangentThrowback
Date Posted: 07 Oct 2020 at 09:02
A bit late in the day, but I wasn't upset at the use of 'z' for 's', I was genuinely wondering if if sounds that hard to people outside the area.  Our flags and stickers from before the club decided Bears was an appropriate name always said 'Bris'.  There's an old book call Krek Waiter's Peak Bristle that gives a flavour of how it sounds locally.  Of course the truly distinctive aspect of the Bristol accent is the Bristol L (more correctly a parasitic L) where words ending in a weak vowel end up with an L.  For example idea becomes ideal.  Your real Bristolian will actually change ideal to idea to avoid confusion.  That's why Bristol has a Balloon Fiestal.  It's even the origin of the place name itself which was originally Bristow(e) and pronounced locally as Bristol (or Bristle).

And yes, Jake Woolmore did start his rugby in Yeovil.  Lucky escape for him.


Posted By: corporalcarrot
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2020 at 14:09
https://www.jerseyreds.je/news_article/ex-reds-players-earn-international-call-ups/" rel="nofollow - https://www.jerseyreds.je/news_article/ex-reds-players-earn-international-call-ups/

Good article on the Jersey Offy.


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Dont kick it. Pick it up and GO FORWARD.



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