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Re: Stadium For Cornwall Latest

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billesleyexile View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billesleyexile Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jul 2019 at 16:44
Originally posted by Rinkadink Rinkadink wrote:

Originally posted by billesleyexile billesleyexile wrote:


I don’t mind being disagreed with on forums

Well that doesn't appear to be the case, you even PMed me.

Quote that’s what discussion in for, but being pulled up twice for something I haven’t said is a bit off.

But that's exactly what you said; that you agree with the first sentence and the RFU should seize control. Here is the sentence you were referring to;

"If you were looking to have a goegraphic spread of teams, you would not have Bristol, Bath and Gloucester in the Premiership."

By implication the second you did not agree with read;

"But there is too much passion and history to change."

...

You then went on about "wrong teams" in "wrong places" and all the rest and wonder why people are disagreeing with you when you clearly complained about these singled out wrong west country clubs when the Midlands by your criteria is far more problematic, hence the hypocrisy.

Even if you've changed your tune or giving benefit of doubt poorly communicated your argument in the first place you are still advocating the destruction or depowering of long existing and well supported clubs, even back in the advent of professionalism. Look to Wales for a case study of your proposal.

On a side note when you use strong terms to make your points you can in turn expect others to use them. To be absolutely clear I have not meant to cause personal upset and I apologise profusely if I have.


Light dawns... I will admit my own error. I quoted 3 sentences of Camquin’s and thought that the first 2 were in fact one - so the sentence I said I entirely agreed with I *thought* ended with the point about too much history and passion to change. So I was quite explicitly saying I wouldn’t start from here but that there’s nothing that can be done about it.

What I thought was his second sentence was the one I said was problematic - which was where he was suggesting where you’d put them instead and I was saying you wouldn’t necessarily put one in Birmingham.

I’m not advocating the destruction of anything - my point has consistently been that the clubs got too much power when the game went pro. I apologise for the confusion of my own making.


Edited by billesleyexile - 27 Jul 2019 at 16:56
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stalwart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jul 2019 at 23:13
Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Originally posted by Dotcom Dotcom wrote:

Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Additionally, I have always been led to believe that supporters in Cornwall are very parochial - so it remains to be seen if there really would be enough support for Pirates even in a new stadium.


Historically you are right, however The Stadium is likely to be viewed as 'Neutral Ground' so in many respects overcomes that issue. 

There is strong evidence of this from days playing at Camborne when crowds were regularly in the 3,000s (Plus one season at a temporary ground in Truro).

Also the Pirates squad not only includes players from clubs across Cornwall but also works with the clubs and thus represents a Pan Cornish support base


A crowd of 3000 is probably sufficient to support Championship rugby, but not for a Premiership side.

I know Cornwall can muster 20000 to go to Twickenham for a county final, but seriously doubt anything like this number would turn out on a fortnightly basis.

Don't forget that, if Pirates were in the Premiership, we'd get a large numbers of away supporters. Cornwall is a very attractive destination, even in the winter.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Joy of (Level) 7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 09:56
Stadium/Stalwart/Dotcom, do Pirates’ home attendances show a marked improvement for Sunday games or do all home games take place on Sundays?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 11:04
Originally posted by Stalwart Stalwart wrote:

Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Originally posted by Dotcom Dotcom wrote:

Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Additionally, I have always been led to believe that supporters in Cornwall are very parochial - so it remains to be seen if there really would be enough support for Pirates even in a new stadium.


Historically you are right, however The Stadium is likely to be viewed as 'Neutral Ground' so in many respects overcomes that issue. 

There is strong evidence of this from days playing at Camborne when crowds were regularly in the 3,000s (Plus one season at a temporary ground in Truro).

Also the Pirates squad not only includes players from clubs across Cornwall but also works with the clubs and thus represents a Pan Cornish support base


A crowd of 3000 is probably sufficient to support Championship rugby, but not for a Premiership side.

I know Cornwall can muster 20000 to go to Twickenham for a county final, but seriously doubt anything like this number would turn out on a fortnightly basis.


Don't forget that, if Pirates were in the Premiership, we'd get a large numbers of away supporters. Cornwall is a very attractive destination, even in the winter.


I have been to Cornwall four times in recent years to support my team, including once by a 7 hour each way train trip in one day.

I can honestly say it is best achieved by making a weekend of it - but this means a significant cost, personally our trip to Guernsey last season was much more enjoyable.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stadium Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 11:46
Raider999 you can fly from London Heathrow 4 times a day in less than one hour and now the new GWR trains get from London Paddington to Truro in 4 hours.Look forward to seeing you again at the new Stadium.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 12:36
Originally posted by stadium stadium wrote:

Raider999 you can fly from London Heathrow 4 times a day in less than one hour and now the new GWR trains get from London Paddington to Truro in 4 hours.Look forward to seeing you again at the new Stadium.


Living on Gatwick's doorstep, I object to flying from Heathrow - however who knows I may do the journey again one day.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kimbo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 12:46
London probably doesn't compare with the rest of the country, and flying isn't an option for many.
If I walk (20 mins) to my neares station in Leics, the best times to Truro are around the six and a half hour mark (and many require several changes).
Bear in mind that the last time I travelled to the Mennaye by train it took nine hours due to various hold-ups causing us to miss connections, and it doesn't look attractive. I've not returned since for this reason.
Sadly, unless I happen to be in Cornwall at the right time for other reasons, I'll be giving it a miss.
I'd bet many others would be similarly affected.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Capt Sparrow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 16:42
I am a Pirates season ticket holder and I am also English. I don't understand or agree with all this negativity around trips to Cornwall. I have recently visited friends in Market Harborough, Leics and went by train.
Going left Penzance 9.00am Arrive MH at 17.06. Only 6 hrs of that on the train, could have been earlier but our tickets did not allow an earlier train from St Pancras. Return to PZ about the same. During my time supporting Pirates I Have travelled to Doncaster and Rotherham back in a day, ditto London so I take all this carping about travel to Cornwall from England with a pinch of salt.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mickyboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 17:01
I think part of the problem with going to Pirates is that they play on a Sunday and it means that will mean a late return home on a Sunday evening or even early Monday morning. People have to work the next day. Looking at S4C I think to make it viable a min crowd of 6000 would be required to sustain premier Rugby would they get those crowds bearing in mind that with TV commitments some games would be played Friday night and Saturday afternoons
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bigmal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 18:14
Originally posted by Capt Sparrow Capt Sparrow wrote:

I am a Pirates season ticket holder and I am also English. I don't understand or agree with all this negativity around trips to Cornwall. I have recently visited friends in Market Harborough, Leics and went by train.
Going left Penzance 9.00am Arrive MH at 17.06. Only 6 hrs of that on the train, could have been earlier but our tickets did not allow an earlier train from St Pancras. Return to PZ about the same. During my time supporting Pirates I Have travelled to Doncaster and Rotherham back in a day, ditto London so I take all this carping about travel to Cornwall from England with a pinch of salt.
 
 

Nothing negative about questioning a 16 hour round trip to watch a game of rugby especially as travelling from anywhere N or E of Bristol by public transport  will almost certainly involve an overnight stay. I'm not knocking committed fans just stating the obvious. The COST of transport is something else I cant see you doing such a trip for much less than £80 even with some form of rail card - add £40 for a ticket and a modest £40 for refreshments then you are talking c£160 BEFORE a B and B.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Capt Sparrow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 18:37
Originally posted by Bigmal Bigmal wrote:

Originally posted by Capt Sparrow Capt Sparrow wrote:

I am a Pirates season ticket holder and I am also English. I don't understand or agree with all this negativity around trips to Cornwall. I have recently visited friends in Market Harborough, Leics and went by train.
Going left Penzance 9.00am Arrive MH at 17.06. Only 6 hrs of that on the train, could have been earlier but our tickets did not allow an earlier train from St Pancras. Return to PZ about the same. During my time supporting Pirates I Have travelled to Doncaster and Rotherham back in a day, ditto London so I take all this carping about travel to Cornwall from England with a pinch of salt.
 
 

Nothing negative about questioning a 16 hour round trip to watch a game of rugby especially as travelling from anywhere N or E of Bristol by public transport  will almost certainly involve an overnight stay. I'm not knocking committed fans just stating the obvious. The COST of transport is something else I cant see you doing such a trip for much less than £80 even with some form of rail card - add £40 for a ticket and a modest £40 for refreshments then you are talking c£160 BEFORE a B and B.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Capt Sparrow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 18:39
Originally posted by Capt Sparrow Capt Sparrow wrote:

Originally posted by Bigmal Bigmal wrote:

Originally posted by Capt Sparrow Capt Sparrow wrote:

I am a Pirates season ticket holder and I am also English. I don't understand or agree with all this negativity around trips to Cornwall. I have recently visited friends in Market Harborough, Leics and went by train.
Going left Penzance 9.00am Arrive MH at 17.06. Only 6 hrs of that on the train, could have been earlier but our tickets did not allow an earlier train from St Pancras. Return to PZ about the same. During my time supporting Pirates I Have travelled to Doncaster and Rotherham back in a day, ditto London so I take all this carping about travel to Cornwall from England with a pinch of salt.
 
 

Nothing negative about questioning a 16 hour round trip to watch a game of rugby especially as travelling from anywhere N or E of Bristol by public transport  will almost certainly involve an overnight stay. I'm not knocking committed fans just stating the obvious. The COST of transport is something else I cant see you doing such a trip for much less than £80 even with some form of rail card - add £40 for a ticket and a modest £40 for refreshments then you are talking c£160 BEFORE a B and B.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Capt Sparrow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 18:56
I used to in my younger days organise Coach trips to away games and the cost was nowhere near £160, even trips to Otley, Rotherham or Doncaster was not as much as £40 less if we had a full coach. The only trips that ever cost over £100 were to Jersey. Also the most expensive ticket at the Mennayer is £25.00.

Don't forget that us Cornish fans, if we want to follow our team, have to do it eleven times a year but you only have to visit us once. We have done overnight trips to Nottingham and Gloucester taking in a Premiership game on the way and for less than £160 travel costs. So no I'm sorry but I still don't get the angst about following to your team to Cornwall Sunday games or not.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote corporalcarrot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 19:21
Originally posted by Capt Sparrow Capt Sparrow wrote:

I am a Pirates season ticket holder and I am also English. I don't understand or agree with all this negativity around trips to Cornwall. I have recently visited friends in Market Harborough, Leics and went by train.
Going left Penzance 9.00am Arrive MH at 17.06. Only 6 hrs of that on the train, could have been earlier but our tickets did not allow an earlier train from St Pancras. Return to PZ about the same. During my time supporting Pirates I Have travelled to Doncaster and Rotherham back in a day, ditto London so I take all this carping about travel to Cornwall from England with a pinch of salt.
 
Well said mate. Travel takes a bit of organising but invariably if you want to see a game you will. I will say that if Pirates commercially need a lot of away supporters to make the project viable they should properly research the negative impact of playing home games on Sunday. The impact on other local clubs in Kernow has been well rehehazelnutd but be absolutely clear as a regular away supporter for games in Penzance SUNDAY IS THE WORST DAY FOR ME and has lead to me throwing in the towel a couple of times. I hope it works out well for Pirates - a smashing community club.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dotcom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 19:32
Don't forget we have a sleeper train from Cornwall on a Sunday Night that with London connections gets you almost anywhere in Sth/Nth mainland Britain way before 9am

And the sleeper is probably the best Train in the UK these days - an absolute treat



Edited by Dotcom - 28 Jul 2019 at 19:43
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 19:57
The length of travel isn't an issue but pirates choose to have the games on a Sunday meaning if you work you have to take the Monday off. As an ex unpaid volunteer taking a days annual leave to facilitate attending was tough. Having said that I'm sure if my DOR was in the same position he would do the same[EMAIL= ][/EMAIL]e
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JonDee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2019 at 20:24
Sorry think some people are looking in the present/past as and when a stadium is built and available for use am sure the stakeholders will work hard to ensure that as many fans as possible can attend. So a mixture of Sat /Sun/Fri Night games will be used .  They will focus on home supporters as is the situation now as apart from local games not many fans will travel and that is across the Championship 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jul 2019 at 09:12
Originally posted by Dotcom Dotcom wrote:

Don't forget we have a sleeper train from Cornwall on a Sunday Night that with London connections gets you almost anywhere in Sth/Nth mainland Britain way before 9am

And the sleeper is probably the best Train in the UK these days - an absolute treat




Not much good for those who have to be in their van by 7:30.

I appreciate that Sunday games allow rugby players across Cornwall to attend - but they make it very difficult for visiting supporters.

Noting that the business plan for the new stadium relies in part on substantial visiting supporters, the two seem at odds with each other.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stalwart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jul 2019 at 09:40
Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Originally posted by Dotcom Dotcom wrote:

Don't forget we have a sleeper train from Cornwall on a Sunday Night that with London connections gets you almost anywhere in Sth/Nth mainland Britain way before 9am

And the sleeper is probably the best Train in the UK these days - an absolute treat




Not much good for those who have to be in their van by 7:30.

I appreciate that Sunday games allow rugby players across Cornwall to attend - but they make it very difficult for visiting supporters.

Noting that the business plan for the new stadium relies in part on substantial visiting supporters, the two seem at odds with each other.

I'm sure the thorny issue of whether to play Friday evening/Saturday or Sunday will be revisited when we move to the new stadium. It's difficult as you'll never please everybody. I take the point that Sundays are difficult for a lot of traveling supporters, but this need to be balanced against catering for your core local support. Maybe Saturday evening would suit - so those who support or play for other clubs in Kernow could do both, and those from up country would still have Sunday to get home. That, of course, means an overnight stop or getting home at silly o clock on Sunday morning.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stadium Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jul 2019 at 13:26
Interesting stat on Radio Cornwall this morning Cornwall has 5 million visitors a year and is second to London for International visitors.The Stadium is planned to be used in many ways other than for rugby and football. All the other activities form part of the Business plan.
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