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Halliford View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Halliford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jun 2020 at 08:05
The game of rugby will only survive if the RFU survives. This seems to me a sensible approach, ensuring that the RFU gets enough income to maintain its investment in rugby, both professional and community. It is 5his money that pays for the staff that work with clubs and schools to promote rugby, that makes grants for club facilities and supports refereeing development. 

I appreciate that many on this forum resent the fact that so much money goes to PRL thus reducing other areas of spend. At the AGM yesterday Bill Sweeney suggested that there was now an opportunity to change the balance. Let’s hope that happens. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PiffPaff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jun 2020 at 09:41
Apparently funding has been pulled from the Aspirational Pathway, no National sides at U18 Counties, U20 Counties and Senior Counties next season, knock effect means no Divisional sides at U18 and U20 and I guess would call in to question participation of County rugby at any level as that funding has also been pulled. Should make the anti-county lobby on here happy and will be the ammunition needed to kill off County rugby all together post CV-19. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jun 2020 at 11:34
While I am no fan of the Adult county competition, I do feel this is the wrong approach.
It means the only pathway is through the professional academies which moves them even closer to ring fenced franchises. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RedWhine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jun 2020 at 13:18
Haven't seen this reported, but hope it doesn't end this way

We all accept rugby is late development sport & U18s Counties is a really good way to capture this & motivate players to give it a real go, even if outside academy structures

2 local examples from Kent in last 2 years Aaron Grandidier, now at Brive & Matas Jurevicius at London Scottish spring to mind & I'm sure plenty more

I know the Uni boys also like coming back for County U20s too - which keeps club relationships going...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Penda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jun 2020 at 21:00
The RFU haven't been interested in amateur representative rugby for years. They have just taken the opportunity to get rid of it completely. No more proud shirts in clubhouses. 

Edited by Penda - 13 Jun 2020 at 21:00
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Joy of (Level) 7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jun 2020 at 22:00
Originally posted by Halliford Halliford wrote:

The game of rugby will only survive if the RFU survives.

Do you really mean this?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sail By Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 09:11
As someone who has been involved in U17/U18 County rugby for a number of years I think that this is a massive mistake. Year on year do we find players who have developed late who we either pass to our local regional academy or get picked up by Universities and end up playing professionally. 

Also let us not forget the coaches who work at this level. We have many great coaches who have a full time job and do not work in "full time" rugby who pass their k knowledge on through this pathway. 

If the RFU do not fund the pathway then CBs have to find a way to make this happen!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fly Half Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 09:22
Todays TheRugbyPaper makes pretty desperate reading regarding the financial position of the game in England,the UK and the wider International game.Australia is on the verge of bankruptcy.

If the money isn't there - it's not only not there but there are very substantial debts - they they can't spend it on this or that. I suspect similar comments could apply to most other sports.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 10:02
But killing the community game will not save the professional game.
The only way to save the professional game in the long term is to keep the community game alive.
This may mean that the professional game has to die and be reborn.

I did say earlier - is this the time to think the unthinkable and invite the league clubs back to build one strong code.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Halliford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 11:01
The RFU doesn’t want to kill the community game. They face a situation of falling revenues, an outdated commitment to the professional game that they cannot yet get out of and a concern that too much money is being spent by community clubs on player payments. Yes, the U20 team, the Sevens squad, the Age Group teams and England Counties will not happen but that is for this strange season only. Provided matches at Twickenham happen, the revenue will recover, even if only slowly.

The RFU sees investment in the community game being through AGPs, RDOs to support Clubs, grants for development and coaching, management and refereeing development. They don’t feel they should be giving money to Clubs to pay players, that should be the choice of the Clubs.

I don’t agree with everything they are doing and perhaps they do get it wrong occasionally but I do see a commitment to the community game, even if that means Level 7 and below which doesn’t interest many on this forum. They also see women’s rugby as a massive growth area so expect more support for that. If you haven’t got a women’s team now you soon will have!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PiffPaff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 12:33
Nigel, sorry what? "too much money is being spent by community clubs on player payments"

If by community clubs you mean Nat 1 and Nat 2 Clubs who use the "community club" tag but still pay large match fees then I agree. If you think for one minute that Clubs at Level 5/6/7 or below get any money of the RFU to fund  players then you are plain wrong. Notwithstanding the "Payment of Players Declaration" that clubs now have to complete how much "money" do you think the RFU is giving to clubs?

AGP funding was CUT last year leaving several "community clubs" stuck between a rock and a hard place who had invested some money on surveys and reports. AGPs will not be funded in any major way in the future because they do not make enough revenue. More RDO's and CRCs are to lose their jobs over the next six months, Grants are being cut or completely withdrawn and quite sure the Referee fraternity are all making a wry-smile on your Referee Development comment.

As for Women's Rugby, yes RFU are dead keen if only to bring in the funding they can get from Government initiatives. If you think that 10, 100, 1000 Womens sides are going to appear in the next 5-10 years then I would a say more like halfway between the two first numbers if we are lucky. 


Edited by PiffPaff - 14 Jun 2020 at 12:47
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Halliford View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Halliford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 13:20
Originally posted by PiffPaff PiffPaff wrote:

Nigel, sorry what? "too much money is being spent by community clubs on player payments"

If by community clubs you mean Nat 1 and Nat 2 Clubs who use the "community club" tag but still pay large match fees then I agree. If you think for one minute that Clubs at Level 5/6/7 or below get any money of the RFU to fund  players then you are plain wrong. Notwithstanding the "Payment of Players Declaration" that clubs now have to complete how much "money" do you think the RFU is giving to clubs?

AGP funding was CUT last year leaving several "community clubs" stuck between a rock and a hard place who had invested some money on surveys and reports. AGPs will not be funded in any major way in the future because they do not make enough revenue. More RDO's and CRCs are to lose their jobs over the next six months, Grants are being cut or completely withdrawn and quite sure the Referee fraternity are all making a wry-smile on your Referee Development comment.

As for Women's Rugby, yes RFU are dead keen if only to bring in the funding they can get from Government initiatives. If you think that 10, 100, 1000 Womens sides are going to appear in the next 5-10 years then I would a say more like halfway between the two first numbers if we are lucky. 

I know very well how little money is given to Clubs by the RFU, particularly at Level 6 and below. The RFU considers Level 3 the top of the Community game but doesn't want those Clubs to overreach on player payments. I was also making the point of what the RFU wants to do with the money it has. We always want them to spend more money on us but are rarely happy with what we get.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kingsheathlad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 14:17
Womens Premiership lost its main sponsor Tyrells for coming season. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 15:16
Originally posted by kingsheathlad kingsheathlad wrote:

Womens Premiership lost its main sponsor Tyrells for coming season. 


Old news reported before.

Apparently they are talking to potential new sponsors
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 18:03
It’s very simple. If you need to cut your cloth then you cut it where it’s not actually necessary. If representative rugby went tomorrow no one with anything other than self interest would shed a tear
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote marigold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 18:13
Surely in the short term in makes more sense for the governing body to spend its resources on seeking to help the clubs survive rather than run county teams, especially the senior county competition which has become simply an after thought at the end of an already long season. I would also suggest that clubs is where CB financial reserves are directed for the next season or two so that going forward all the players who play may end up playing county rugby have an original base to come from.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Redted Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jun 2020 at 11:13
The RFU sees investment in the community game being through AGPs, RDOs to support Clubs, grants for development and coaching, management and refereeing development. They don’t feel they should be giving money to Clubs to pay players, that should be the choice of the Clubs.

Clubs at Level 3 & 4 don't get RFU grants, just loans.  RDO's do nothing of substance, never see ours and the schools all play rugby so he is not needed there.  AGP's not sure who or what they/this are.   
RFU don't give Level 3 & 4 clubs ANY money to pay for players just around a 40% contribution to travel costs.  If the travel contribution is cut they clubs on the edges of the country suffer big time but clubs near the RFU in the much richer South East are all all right Jack. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote marigold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jun 2020 at 11:30
AGP = artificial grass pitch
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jun 2020 at 11:44
Your county might not need a RDO - but outside the Duchy most state school do not offer rugby.
So there is a role for a RDO in getting pupils their first experience of the game.

I am totally with you on travel - Cambridge is lucky as we are fairly central.

AGP is I believe the plan to roll out 3G pitches.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Redted Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jun 2020 at 12:38
AGP - Great for the host club but for the rest unimportant.
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