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Yorkshire Cup 2018/19

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hrplaneman View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hrplaneman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Yorkshire Cup 2018/19
    Posted: 14 Mar 2019 at 13:43
Being rather late to this thread, it is disheartening to read of the virtual demise of this age old competition. I certainly remember games being played, not that long ago with hundreds of supporters watching semi-final and finals games.

Those games were played both at weekends but more importantly as evening fixtures county wide. Surely this could be reintroduced or stated as one of the competition rules. Similarly why not at certain levels include 2nd XV's or academies as team entries? 

The one continuing factor in all of this is the exceptionally poor performance of the CB. They have Im afraid been too busy admiring the premiership trough that the blessed Carnegie organisation are ever hopeful of feeding at, but which now look increasingly less likely given their present predicament. Which, if they fold as many are predicting, not only takes away a championship side, but also loses the county all of the age grade junior sides that the CB saw fit to offer to Carnegie on a golden platter, believing that their coaching and player development/selection processes were better than had previously been managed effectively, by a wide and varied group of volunteers to identify those players for development through club, county and country age grade teams.
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Sid James View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sid James Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 18:13
Originally posted by Richard Lowther Richard Lowther wrote:

Originally posted by Puli. Puli. wrote:

Think you are right openthegate in forecasting that the competition will be abandoned, and if it is I cannot see it ever continuing in its present format,


Next season the county is celebrating its 150th anniversary. The Cup should be a centre point of this. If the format is to change, then someone needs to make the decision quickly.


You answered your own question there Richard.
You mentioned making a 'decision' and doing it 'quickly"

No chance.
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openthegate View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote openthegate Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 17:31
Depends on what clubs want from pre season as there are clubs from level 3/4/5 & 6 involved in the main cup. I do think the first round/1/4's should be played in pre season though
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Remember Izal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 16:30
I have always puzzled why Counties do it as a pre season tournament
Round 1 8 teams
Round 2 4 team semi final
Round 3 final 2 teams.
 
all the losers in round 1 then play in a plate on the same weekends to get to a Plate final.
 
It takes up 3 weekends and all of the losers can play each other.
 
Saves organising pre season and travel costs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Richard Lowther Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 15:06
Originally posted by Puli. Puli. wrote:

Think you are right openthegate in forecasting that the competition will be abandoned, and if it is I cannot see it ever continuing in its present format,


Next season the county is celebrating its 150th anniversary. The Cup should be a centre point of this. If the format is to change, then someone needs to make the decision quickly.
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Puli. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Puli. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 14:51
Think you are right openthegate in forecasting that the competition will be abandoned, and if it is I cannot see it ever continuing in its present format,
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openthegate View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote openthegate Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 11:47
Gate could also be in the mx for a playoff place if results go their way to throw another date into the mix.
Can't see the final being played as Gate have made it their without playing a game in the competition, so I would expect Yorkshire to cancel it.

Even though it is my club they do have a good record recently

18/19 - Finalist by default
17/18 - Semi finalists lost to Donny Phoenix
16/17 - Winners - Sheff Tigers defaulted the final due to league fixtures
15/16 - Winners - beat Sheff Tigers
14/15 - Winners - beat Wharfedale
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trident Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 09:38
Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Originally posted by Trident Trident wrote:

Originally posted by Stoo The Zoom Stoo The Zoom wrote:

Another none match, Harrogate v Sheffield,  Yorks. Cup semi-final has been called off, Sheffield have to play a rearranged league fixture. Despite discussions between the Clubs and Yorkshire I don't think a suitable date for the match can be found due to league fixtures.

Can't they play it after the league fixtures are done with - 13/4/19



First post says final is due to be 17th April - so that would need to be put back

Doubt it will even take place, but.
All Yorkshire cup Comps are having to be put back.

17th April was more than a little ambitious.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 09:17
Originally posted by Trident Trident wrote:

Originally posted by Stoo The Zoom Stoo The Zoom wrote:

Another none match, Harrogate v Sheffield,  Yorks. Cup semi-final has been called off, Sheffield have to play a rearranged league fixture. Despite discussions between the Clubs and Yorkshire I don't think a suitable date for the match can be found due to league fixtures.

Can't they play it after the league fixtures are done with - 13/4/19



First post says final is due to be 17th April - so that would need to be put back
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trident Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 23:13
Originally posted by Stoo The Zoom Stoo The Zoom wrote:

Another none match, Harrogate v Sheffield,  Yorks. Cup semi-final has been called off, Sheffield have to play a rearranged league fixture. Despite discussions between the Clubs and Yorkshire I don't think a suitable date for the match can be found due to league fixtures.

Can't they play it after the league fixtures are done with - 13/4/19

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stoo The Zoom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 19:11
Another none match, Harrogate v Sheffield,  Yorks. Cup semi-final has been called off, Sheffield have to play a rearranged league fixture. Despite discussions between the Clubs and Yorkshire I don't think a suitable date for the match can be found due to league fixtures.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Willy Mclintosh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Mar 2019 at 19:41
Sandal's programme from yesterday's match states "the team are fully committed to this competition".
The draw must have taken place as we have an away fixture against Wharfedale in the semi final. Date to yet be confirmed.
 
The final is stated to be on 17th April.
 
I cant see any free weekends for Wharfedale before 17th April but Sandal currently have a blank weekend on 16th March.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Count Ford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 20:41
I believe in Cheshire, for each round they just set a date that the tie has to have been played by. This usually allows a couple of blank weekends option and the teams can make it suit them.

Even then...you still get teams pulling out occasionally
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trident Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 19:05
Originally posted by tulip tulip wrote:

Originally posted by Trident Trident wrote:

Originally posted by tulip tulip wrote:

It's a pity they hadn't done semi final draw
We probably could have played them tomorrow

There's a reason for that.


The quarterfinals and semifinals of European Cup
are drawn together. In this instance if Sandal had been drawn against
Harrogate we could have played and at least 1 club would have some income

No, reason being, they are seriously considering pulling the Cup.
They are also aware that there is decreasing interest in the other County Cup comps, more so now clubs only play against teams in their League.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ex Coach Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 12:34
The incentive for winning the county cup largely disappeared once the opportunity for the winners to play in the John Player cup with the chance of a money spinning tie against one of the glamour clubs at home.

I used to enjoy some of these first round matches and amongst others remember Hinckley playing Northampton Saints and particularly sitting in a large crowd at Lichfield on haybales watching them play Harlequins. I'm sure the health and safety people wouldn't allow that nowadays.
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Sid James View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sid James Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 09:04
Originally posted by Puli. Puli. wrote:

Sid James. .... Have you put your club’s concerns about the organisation of the Yorkshire Cup to the East Riding Clubs representative on the County Committee, and if so what was their response ? If not have you considered putting yourself forward to serve on the said Committee as in that way your voice and concerns/suggestions would then be heard.


Puli, please remember that any comments or observations I make on this forum are my own and not my clubs.
The answer to your first question is no, but I have put my point to a York's RFU committee member and it fell on deaf ears.

Your next point is typical. "If you think you can do a better job, you do it". What is wrong with expecting those elected and currently in position, to do a proper job and listen to the clubs they represent?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PercyR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 08:50
It's a carrot and stick world, and the clubs and authorities have both loaded the importance of league matches to a point where county cups have fallen by the wayside as meaningless.

League standing has become the be all and end all with relegation seen as unacceptable. And the authorities have added to this sense of importance by using league points, and therefore possible relegation, as the main sanction for misdoings.

If a club does not play a league fixture then it loses league points which is perfectly understandable; but league point deduction, actual, threatened or suspended, has also become the ultimate punishment for a wide variety of indiscretions - administrative errors, allowing under age players in lower teams, or too many red cards across a club's sides, have all resulted in 1st XVs losing points in the past couple of seasons.

If relegation is all important, the fear of it becomes pervasive and clubs become risk averse, calling off cup games to 'protect' players from theoretical harm.

If the stick was augmented and clubs lost league points, or international ticket allocations, or some other such meaningful retribution, then the carrot of winning a cup might suddenly become more appealing.
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Puli. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Puli. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2019 at 13:37
Sid James. .... Have you put your club’s concerns about the organisation of the Yorkshire Cup to the East Riding Clubs representative on the County Committee, and if so what was their response ? If not have you considered putting yourself forward to serve on the said Committee as in that way your voice and concerns/suggestions would then be heard.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thatbloke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2019 at 12:43
I suppose the correct way to do that is before the draw is made and then you're not upsetting or affecting other clubs
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote openthegate Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2019 at 12:33
You can decide before the season if you don’t want to enter - Wharfedale did a few seasons back.
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