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Yorkshire Cup 2018/19

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Mountain Man View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mountain Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 2019 at 18:54
And yet at the lower levels of league rugby the powers that be continue to insist that the way forward is to reduce league numbers yet further and fill some of the blank Saturdays with cup games or even friendlies. Perhaps they don't understand that clubs need to bring some revenue in on Saturdays between September and April. Buffoons springs to mind.  We used to travel miles on a Wednesday night in search of the Holy Grail of T'Owd Tin Pot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 2019 at 21:08
Originally posted by tulip tulip wrote:

Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

It seems to me that this subject has more minutes of hot air than rugby played in the last couple of years.

Time for it to be permanently binned perhaps?


How's the Sussex Cup doing mate. If you have that opinion don't read it.


Typical of a Yorkshire man - shame there aren't enough that care to get a team or 2 out!😭

As for the Sussex cup - I didn't realise we were talking about it!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote openthegate Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Feb 2019 at 16:57
To make it a full house Ilkley have just cried off - absolute poor form on a Friday!
Ilkley have a prop playing Yorkshire 20's on Sunday, but this game has been in the fixtures for a long time, so not like it has just been sprung on them. Wonder if you can raise a team next weekend..........


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tulip Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Feb 2019 at 17:49
It's a pity they hadn't done semi final draw
We probably could have played them tomorrow
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trident Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Feb 2019 at 18:33
Originally posted by tulip tulip wrote:

It's a pity they hadn't done semi final draw
We probably could have played them tomorrow

There's a reason for that.

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Sid James View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sid James Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Feb 2019 at 22:00
There is no need to lose the Yorkshire Cup altogether. If it is lost, the fault will lie entirely with the Yorks RFU rather than the Clubs.

There is every need for the York's RFU Committee to start listening to the Clubs it represents, re-schedule the dates of matches to not clash with league fixtures and have some flexibility.

It is clear that the York's RFU Committee needs a few more members who are involved with National League Clubs. The current bunch just don't have a clue.
Mountain Man is right, "Buffoons" does spring to mind.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Feb 2019 at 23:42
Originally posted by Sid James Sid James wrote:

There is no need to lose the Yorkshire Cup altogether. If it is lost, the fault will lie entirely with the Yorks RFU rather than the Clubs.

There is every need for the York's RFU Committee to start listening to the Clubs it represents, re-schedule the dates of matches to not clash with league fixtures and have some flexibility.

It is clear that the York's RFU Committee needs a few more members who are involved with National League Clubs. The current bunch just don't have a clue.
Mountain Man is right, "Buffoons" does spring to mind.


Not sure how the clubs are blameless in this mess. They are the ones who enter, nobody forces them as far as I am aware, then pull out after the draw has been made.

Has anyone analysed the number of home sides tha pull out against the away sides that pull out?

Do they play chicken? Leave it late to pull out hoping the other side do first?

Do they pay a fee to enter the cup, if not maybe they should introduce one - even if it is refunded unless you concede?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote openthegate Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Feb 2019 at 23:55
Strange thing with Ilkley is that their 2's and 3's are still playing tomorrow, but can't raise a first team?
Surely you fill from below, most sides will have already used 30+ players already this year, so shouldn't be a case of players not being able to step up etc.

I've seen many full 2's sides take on other clubs full 1's team. Fair enough if you were asking 3rd teamers to step up it would be a stretch, but not 2nd teamers stepping up to play 1's - isn't that why you play second team rugby, to get that chance to play first team?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote openthegate Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Feb 2019 at 23:57
Also why do facebook comments from your own fans keep on being deleted about what a bad decision it is to pull out? Especially as you made a big fuss in November about B&B doing it to you......
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Sid James View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sid James Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2019 at 09:25
Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Originally posted by Sid James Sid James wrote:

There is no need to lose the Yorkshire Cup altogether. If it is lost, the fault will lie entirely with the Yorks RFU rather than the Clubs.

There is every need for the York's RFU Committee to start listening to the Clubs it represents, re-schedule the dates of matches to not clash with league fixtures and have some flexibility.

It is clear that the York's RFU Committee needs a few more members who are involved with National League Clubs. The current bunch just don't have a clue.
Mountain Man is right, "Buffoons" does spring to mind.


Not sure how the clubs are blameless in this mess. They are the ones who enter, nobody forces them as far as I am aware, then pull out after the draw has been made.

Has anyone analysed the number of home sides tha pull out against the away sides that pull out?

Do they play chicken? Leave it late to pull out hoping the other side do first?

Do they pay a fee to enter the cup, if not maybe they should introduce one - even if it is refunded unless you concede?


Raider999,

You are missing the key point.
The dates when the matches are to be played are set by the York's RFU, who have no regard at all for scheduled league matches. There are free league weekends but York's RFU ignore them. They put National league Clubs into preliminary rounds, that clash with league matches, when non-national league clubs have a free weekend.
York's RFU then act in such a dictatorial manner towards requests for cancellation and re-scheduling, that some Clubs are left with no choice but to withdraw.
Yorks RFU have recently cancelled the final rather than re-schedule. How crazy is that?

This is why I say that York's RFU are the primary cause of the problem and totally at fault if we lose the York's Cup altogether.

Edited by Sid James - 23 Feb 2019 at 09:27
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tulip View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tulip Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2019 at 11:16
Originally posted by Trident Trident wrote:

Originally posted by tulip tulip wrote:

It's a pity they hadn't done semi final draw
We probably could have played them tomorrow

There's a reason for that.


The quarterfinals and semifinals of European Cup
are drawn together. In this instance if Sandal had been drawn against
Harrogate we could have played and at least 1 club would have some income
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thatbloke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2019 at 11:33
I am fairly sure that right across all the CB's every club is automatically entered into the county knockout competitions at their relevant level - Cup, Vase, Shield etc. They are NOT required to register an "entry" - probably a good job as it stands!! It does seem strange that in Yorkshire your National League clubs are required to play preliminary rounds (Otley, Hull Ionians and Huddersfield this season) when they have to fit in 30 league games as it is (as opposed to 26 for Level 5 and below) Surely it would make sense for these clubs to be seeded through to the first round and let the lower level clubs compete in the preliminary round??
I thought County Committees were elected to facilitate and develop the clubs they represent not to act as an Enforcer - if two clubs agree a mutually convenient date to play a cup tie (even if it's between two 2nd XV's for those clubs who aren't too interested) then let them get on with it rather than the "Rules is Rules" stance adopted by most CB's. Certainly in my region, North Mids, clubs have been expelled from the competition for failing to play on the designated date which is ludicrous and perhaps a reason why there isn't much respect or support given to the Counties by their member clubs. The more ties that are played the more relevant the competition becomes- the alternative is as suggested by many on here - county cup competitions will be lost forever
And who's fault will that be? Clubs or Counties? I know where my vote goes
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote openthegate Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2019 at 12:33
You can decide before the season if you don’t want to enter - Wharfedale did a few seasons back.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thatbloke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2019 at 12:43
I suppose the correct way to do that is before the draw is made and then you're not upsetting or affecting other clubs
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Puli. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2019 at 13:37
Sid James. .... Have you put your club’s concerns about the organisation of the Yorkshire Cup to the East Riding Clubs representative on the County Committee, and if so what was their response ? If not have you considered putting yourself forward to serve on the said Committee as in that way your voice and concerns/suggestions would then be heard.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PercyR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 08:50
It's a carrot and stick world, and the clubs and authorities have both loaded the importance of league matches to a point where county cups have fallen by the wayside as meaningless.

League standing has become the be all and end all with relegation seen as unacceptable. And the authorities have added to this sense of importance by using league points, and therefore possible relegation, as the main sanction for misdoings.

If a club does not play a league fixture then it loses league points which is perfectly understandable; but league point deduction, actual, threatened or suspended, has also become the ultimate punishment for a wide variety of indiscretions - administrative errors, allowing under age players in lower teams, or too many red cards across a club's sides, have all resulted in 1st XVs losing points in the past couple of seasons.

If relegation is all important, the fear of it becomes pervasive and clubs become risk averse, calling off cup games to 'protect' players from theoretical harm.

If the stick was augmented and clubs lost league points, or international ticket allocations, or some other such meaningful retribution, then the carrot of winning a cup might suddenly become more appealing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sid James Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 09:04
Originally posted by Puli. Puli. wrote:

Sid James. .... Have you put your club’s concerns about the organisation of the Yorkshire Cup to the East Riding Clubs representative on the County Committee, and if so what was their response ? If not have you considered putting yourself forward to serve on the said Committee as in that way your voice and concerns/suggestions would then be heard.


Puli, please remember that any comments or observations I make on this forum are my own and not my clubs.
The answer to your first question is no, but I have put my point to a York's RFU committee member and it fell on deaf ears.

Your next point is typical. "If you think you can do a better job, you do it". What is wrong with expecting those elected and currently in position, to do a proper job and listen to the clubs they represent?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ex Coach Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 12:34
The incentive for winning the county cup largely disappeared once the opportunity for the winners to play in the John Player cup with the chance of a money spinning tie against one of the glamour clubs at home.

I used to enjoy some of these first round matches and amongst others remember Hinckley playing Northampton Saints and particularly sitting in a large crowd at Lichfield on haybales watching them play Harlequins. I'm sure the health and safety people wouldn't allow that nowadays.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trident Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 19:05
Originally posted by tulip tulip wrote:

Originally posted by Trident Trident wrote:

Originally posted by tulip tulip wrote:

It's a pity they hadn't done semi final draw
We probably could have played them tomorrow

There's a reason for that.


The quarterfinals and semifinals of European Cup
are drawn together. In this instance if Sandal had been drawn against
Harrogate we could have played and at least 1 club would have some income

No, reason being, they are seriously considering pulling the Cup.
They are also aware that there is decreasing interest in the other County Cup comps, more so now clubs only play against teams in their League.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Count Ford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 20:41
I believe in Cheshire, for each round they just set a date that the tie has to have been played by. This usually allows a couple of blank weekends option and the teams can make it suit them.

Even then...you still get teams pulling out occasionally
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